Live prey vs......

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Originally Posted by SiscoReptiles

Fact is..

If Joe feeds live and monitors them and his rats never bite his snake, he can start to feel comfortable and become relaxed on his responsibility to monitor them. I realize there are people who may not do this, but as humans.. humans are lazy and get bored rather easy.. or perhaps the phone rings, or perhaps a friend shows up and Joe gets sidetracked.. It happens...

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I've been feeding hundreds of animals live every single week for over 10 years ... never had a problem (not one single scratch, bite, or mauling) ... sounds more like an opinion than a "fact". ;)

-adam

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Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

I've been feeding hundreds of animals live every single week for over 10 years ... never had a problem (not one single scratch, bite, or mauling) ... sounds more like an opinion than a "fact". ;)

-adam

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Adam,

With all due respect, I did not say all people who feed live are irresponsible or careless. I said it does happen, and it does happen all too often. There are less people who know what they are doing than those who do. People who bought a snake, had it for a few months and assume since rats have never bothered their snake before so feel its ok to "just run to the store" with the rat in there. I assume, Adam, that you would not do this.. but I also assume that since you have been doing this for 10 years you have seen many, many careless people in the hobby. I run a rescue as well, my way to give back to the hobby that I enjoy, and I this all to often and I know our vet sees more of it than I do.

Rick

I feed all seventeen of mine live every week as well, mice and small/small rats. I would never just "run out" during feeding - there's a set time each week dedicated to feeding, uninterrupted, and I don't start cooking, or cleaning until everyone is tucked back into their hides.

I've been doing this for over a year now, and I have also not ever experienced any injuries.

I think that MOST of the members on this forum, who feed live know how to do so responsibly.

BP.net prides itself in supporting each keepers right to choose how they'd like to feed without concern of someone telling them that they are wrong for their choice. I don't feed p/k or f/t, but I also don't tell those people that feeding live is better, just that it is my choice.

Based on my personal experience, the "scare tactics" that p/k-f/t advocates love to use by posting graphic pictures of mauled snakes from irresponsible live feeding (leaving live prey overnight with their snake for example) are a bit like crying wolf and is not an accurate representation of responsible live feeding. Yes, it does drive home the fact that one should not feed live if they haven't carefully thought through it, but it isn't evidence that routine responsible live feeding by well informed keepers will result in injuries.

I'd like to think that the bulk of our membership have joined this forum, because they DO want to become well-informed, whether it be to learn more about keeping their snakes in tubs or glass vivs, how to convert a live feeder to p/k or f/t, or how to safely feed live.

OK, off my :soapbx:

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I'd like to think that the bulk of our membership have joined this forum, because they DO want to become well-informed, whether it be to learn more about keeping their snakes in tubs or glass vivs, how to convert a live feeder to p/k or f/t, or how to safely feed live.

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exactly why i joined this site!!:sweeet:

I had a creamsickel corn and he was a shy eater would only eat in a small dark shoe box. I bought 2 small tub of pinkies from pet smart (40$for 12 pinkies). Well they were rotten and I didn't know he died the day after feeding. So I thawed one out a looked at it underthe light and when it was frozen it was blood red and brown when thawed. My husband took a look a said it looked rotten too. I call pet smart and they said they'd check their frozen mice but as far as my snake or refunding my money they said they couldn't help me. I cryed over the loss for over two weeks, my uncle bought me Clair to replace him (I love her but nothing can replace my first baby.):crying: (It was my first snake so I didn't know any better) and I'm still kicking my self for even walking in there!

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Originally Posted by rabernet

How did you lose one to pre-killed?

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that's why if you feed live you have to watch to make sure that does'n happen. it said the owner left a rat in there over night and i hope most poeple are smart enough not to do that. by the way it made me sick the poor poor thing!!!

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Originally Posted by SiscoReptiles

:soapbx:

Let this help you decide -> (Graphic Warning - LINK)

Rick

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by SiscoReptiles

In reply..

No offense taken or given, but I did not say feeding live was good or bad.. I just said let that help you decide, anything else was read into it. I will state I feed fresh killed or frozen/thawed most of the time, but sometimes you need to start a new snake on live first if that is what it is used to.
Rick

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I appoligize for the way that came across. I noticed i missed a word in there to after re-reading it. I meant to say i dont think it should be brought up just to say live feeding is just bad. Also, I wasnt really directing that at you (although looking back, i see thats exactly how it looks). I have seen cases where pics or storys like that were used by people to just out right bash live feeding in any case (not even taking into account problem feeders), which is what i had in mind when I said that.

Again, I did NOT say feeding live was bad, nor did I use scare tactics to say feeding live was bad. I have posted repeatedly that live is even required at times. I posted that I do not recommend to people who buy snakes from me to feed live if the snake I am selling has already been converted to prekilled, what is the point if the snake is already willingly taking prekilled?

The picture was posted since this thread is a debate of the pros and cons. The picture was not a scare tactic, it was an indicator of what can happen IF you feed live and are not responsible about it, as I posted in my prior thread.

Yes, most of the people here are here to ask and learn. That's wonderful and it's a great site that teaches responsibility, but not everyone who goes to a pet store or who orders a snake online comes here. Many of those people do not know. The owner of the snake pictured on that site is a local who took that snake to my regular herp vet. It happens around here all too often. The girl thought "Rats eat grain. I had no idea the rat would eat the snake." I have heard many after-thought regrets by several people who have also made this mistake. If that picture makes someone think twice, if this post makes someone realize that irresponsible feeding of live is bad, than I have made my point.

Again... I did NOT say feeding live was bad. I said that irresponsible feeding of live is bad, and that it's easy for someone to fall into the lull of safety offered when you feed live for years and nothing bad happens, they then think it's safe to leave the room for just a few minutes. Perhaps nothing bad happens at all. Then next time maybe for an hour, maybe a few hours.. Now things get dangerous. That is the point I am making.

Rick

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Originally Posted by rabernet

I feed all seventeen of mine live every week as well, mice and small/small rats. I would never just "run out" during feeding - there's a set time each week dedicated to feeding, uninterrupted, and I don't start cooking, or cleaning until everyone is tucked back into their hides.

I've been doing this for over a year now, and I have also not ever experienced any injuries.

I think that MOST of the members on this forum, who feed live know how to do so responsibly.

BP.net prides itself in supporting each keepers right to choose how they'd like to feed without concern of someone telling them that they are wrong for their choice. I don't feed p/k or f/t, but I also don't tell those people that feeding live is better, just that it is my choice.

Based on my personal experience, the "scare tactics" that p/k-f/t advocates love to use by posting graphic pictures of mauled snakes from irresponsible live feeding (leaving live prey overnight with their snake for example) are a bit like crying wolf and is not an accurate representation of responsible live feeding. Yes, it does drive home the fact that one should not feed live if they haven't carefully thought through it, but it isn't evidence that routine responsible live feeding by well informed keepers will result in injuries.

I'd like to think that the bulk of our membership have joined this forum, because they DO want to become well-informed, whether it be to learn more about keeping their snakes in tubs or glass vivs, how to convert a live feeder to p/k or f/t, or how to safely feed live.

OK, off my :soapbx:

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Originally Posted by piranhaking

I appoligize for the way that came across. I noticed i missed a word in there to after re-reading it. I meant to say i dont think it should be brought up just to say live feeding is just bad. Also, I wasnt really directing that at you (although looking back, i see thats exactly how it looks). I have seen cases where pics or storys like that were used by people to just out right bash live feeding in any case (not even taking into account problem feeders), which is what i had in mind when I said that.

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No problem man,

"Live vs Prekilled" will always be a debate. I agree both have their uses. When it comes down to it, it's all opinion.. like Chevy vs Ford, Pepsi vs Coke.. I personally use both prekilled and live. I am not against responsible use of live feeding, just adding food for thought. ;)

Rick

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Originally Posted by SiscoReptiles

Again... I did NOT say feeding live was bad. I said that irresponsible feeding of live is bad, and that it's easy for someone to fall into the lull of safety offered when you feed live for years and nothing bad happens, they then think it's safe to leave the room for just a few minutes. Perhaps nothing bad happens at all. Then next time maybe for an hour, maybe a few hours.. Now things get dangerous. That is the point I am making.

Rick

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Why do you assume that "the next time" responsible live feeders will just leave for an hour or a few hours? I can assure you - I take the responsiblity VERY seriously. I happen to have a bit more confidence than you do in our members here who take the time to learn how to do it correctly.

Like I said - I don't care what anyone feeds their snakes - as long as they are fully informed of ALL their options and are not made to think that feeding p/k or f/t is preferable.