Update on Fluffy's clutch + pics

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rapture

http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k1...1/pipping1.jpg

http://i84.photobucket.com/albums/k1...1/pipping3.jpg

---

WhooT-WhooT!! Where was my phone call?:mad: I would have been there in PJ's! Congratz hunE!:P

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by recycling goddess

you literally took my breathe away!

congratulations congratulations :fest2: congratulations congratulations congratulations :fest: congratulations congratulations congratulations :wuv: congratulations congratulations congratulations :bday: congratulationscongratulations congratulations :pinkele: congratulations :sweeet: congratulations :fest2: congratulations :fest: congratulations :wuv: congratulations :bday: congratulations congratulations congratulations :pinkele: congratulations :sweeet: congratulations :fest2: congratulations congratulations congratulations :fest: congratulations :wuv: congratulations :bday: congratulations :pinkele: congratulations :bday:


congratulations how does it feel to be a :grandma:


congratulations :blowkiss:

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TheAudOne

Good for you, it must feel great that they came out just fine.

Your trusted your gut and did what you thought was best.

It must feel good hu?


And I would like to add my 2 cents.

Being a mom not a breeder though, being pregnant, giving birth, caring for eggs etc. Is stressful...who said it isnt and wasnt going to be? I wish when I got pregnant someone took my fetus, put her in a sterile environment and "raised her" so I could eat and rest the whole 9 months. You wanna talk about stress? Try throwing up 12 times a day for 9 months! Only to have to learn to nurse and take care of an infant on only 1/2 hour of sleep a day. She's 2 now and still I'm just as tired and stressed as the first day.

But even after all that, it was worth it. And I would do it 100 more times with out thought...why? Because I'm a woman and thats what my body was created to do for me.

I'm not saying a snake has any gradification after hatching her eggs herself or anything who knows. But wasnt she designed for this?

Were all saying "its in the animals best interest to put her eggs in an incubater" why not give her the one natural thing we can, while we have her living in this "plastic nature" I know taking a dogs pups away after birth induces stree in them, I even had a cat jump the fence into my waiting rottweilers and pitbulls mouths to get her kittens I had rescued.

I'm not saying snakes are like dogs or cats or people...but all the way across the board (excluding snakes in some peoples eyes) birth and taking care of there young is a process females do, and do better then any plastic box on most days.

If her eggs were left then yeah, if you felt it was right to take them and incubate them, then go for it.

But if a mother is holding onto her eggs and wanting to take her chances then why not let her know she is capable of this?

Obviously she knows what she's doing.
Birth is stressful end of story, stressful knwoing you could die from birth, your babies could die etc. etc.
Its a chance nature has set us up to take.

---

Oh where to start? First off, nobody ever said that they wouldn't hatch. Obviously maternal incubation is the only way possible to hatch eggs in the wild, right? What does you having a baby remotely have to do with snakes?

Quote:

---

I could understand saying "do whats best for the snake and incubate the eggs" because while shes sitting on the eggs for 60 days, not eating or resting a breeder is losing money hu?

So who is doing whats best for the snakes? Breeders are creating more snakes, when there are millions looking for good homes.....hmmmm. And Sapphire over here is letting her little mama...well be a mama.

---

What exactly are you talking about? Breeders are the problem here? :confused:

how did I know you would be the fist one to jump on me? ;)
I'm just saying, no one is right and no one is wrong, some people eat meat and some dont, some people say cats are better then dogs and others say dogs are better then cats..does that mean I should run up to them and tell them how wrong they are for eating meat and not likeing dogs? Hell no.

Its rare for me to ever talk or post any where when I know someone is going to get mad, I never want to ruffle feathers (or scales) I'm a peace maker at heart, but I was just sitting here reading your posts and couldnt help but notice you were getting pretty pissed at some points.

I was trying to cool the situation and get everyone off there soap boxes and back to reality, no one is perfect, there are always 2 ways to do something and were all human.

So by all means, say again 'where to start" and try coming off as the smartest person in the room.

If you cant figure out the connection between me having a child and being a woman, compared to a snake caring for a clutch them I'm sorry.

I agree with Jamie. We didn't say they wouldn't hatch, but were concerned about the increased risk of RIs due to increased humidity and the possibility of getting the female back eating faster (after losing a third of their body weight). Rapture decided that, after reading scientific articles, that he would achieve healthier neonates by allowing maternal incubation. No one can say how they would have differed had they been artificially incubated. Fortunately it looks like we have some beautiful babies about to come into this world. I can't wait to see all of them!

TheAudOne, you keep making comparisons of reptiles to mammals and then saying their nothing alike. Why not try and make your argument with something that can be used appropriately in comparison. It would greatly add to the discussion.

Also I feel like you are saying that anyone who uses an incubator is only in it for profit. (which I'm slightly offended by) Do you realize you incur a greater cost on equipment and cost of heating it? It would be much more cost efficient to allow maternal incubation. Which is why many people choose maternal incubation. This is not the case here, but is the reason why I've continued in this discussion.

Anyway, back to the wonderful pictures. You must post more ASAP!! I can't wait until the little ones have fully emerged. :clap:

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TheAudOne

how did I know you would be the fist one to jump on me? ;)
I'm just saying, no one is right and no one is wrong, some people eat meat and some dont, some people say cats are better then dogs and others say dogs are better then cats..does that mean I should run up to them and tell them how wrong they are for eating meat and not likeing dogs? Hell no.

Its rare for me to ever talk or post any where when I know someone is going to get mad, I never want to ruffle feathers (or scales) I'm a peace maker at heart, but I was just sitting here reading your posts and couldnt help but notice you were getting pretty pissed at some points.

I was trying to cool the situation and get everyone off there soap boxes and back to reality, no one is perfect, there are always 2 ways to do something and were all human.

So by all means, say again 'where to start" and try coming off as the smartest person in the room.

If you cant figure out the connection between me having a child and being a woman, compared to a snake caring for a clutch them I'm sorry.

---

Nobody is jumping on you. Last I checked, constructive debate is still allowed here. Nobody is on their soap box (except for you in your last post). There is no correlation between you having a child and a snake procreating. Try to stop associating your human feelings and needs with that of a snake. Also, why the thinly veiled attack on people breeding snakes as shown here?

Quote:

---

I could understand saying "do whats best for the snake and incubate the eggs" because while shes sitting on the eggs for 60 days, not eating or resting a breeder is losing money hu?

So who is doing whats best for the snakes? Breeders are creating more snakes, when there are millions looking for good homes.....hmmmm. And Sapphire over here is letting her little mama...well be a mama.

---

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jglass38

Try to stop associating your human feelings and needs with that of a snake.

---

You know everyone has different views in this. No need to re-bring it up.:(
Also last time I heard everyone had a right to their own freedom of expression/opinions here.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TheAudOne

Good for you, it must feel great that they came out just fine.

Your trusted your gut and did what you thought was best.

It must feel good hu?


And I would like to add my 2 cents.

Being a mom not a breeder though, being pregnant, giving birth, caring for eggs etc. Is stressful...who said it isnt and wasnt going to be? I wish when I got pregnant someone took my fetus, put her in a sterile environment and "raised her" so I could eat and rest the whole 9 months. You wanna talk about stress? Try throwing up 12 times a day for 9 months! Only to have to learn to nurse and take care of an infant on only 1/2 hour of sleep a day. She's 2 now and still I'm just as tired and stressed as the first day.

But even after all that, it was worth it. And I would do it 100 more times with out thought...why? Because I'm a woman and thats what my body was created to do for me.

I'm not saying a snake has any gradification after hatching her eggs herself or anything who knows. But wasnt she designed for this?

Were all saying "its in the animals best interest to put her eggs in an incubater" why not give her the one natural thing we can, while we have her living in this "plastic nature" I know taking a dogs pups away after birth induces stree in them, I even had a cat jump the fence into my waiting rottweilers and pitbulls mouths to get her kittens I had rescued.

I'm not saying snakes are like dogs or cats or people...but all the way across the board (excluding snakes in some peoples eyes) birth and taking care of there young is a process females do, and do better then any plastic box on most days.

If her eggs were left then yeah, if you felt it was right to take them and incubate them, then go for it.

But if a mother is holding onto her eggs and wanting to take her chances then why not let her know she is capable of this?

Obviously she knows what she's doing.
Birth is stressful end of story, stressful knwoing you could die from birth, your babies could die etc. etc.
Its a chance nature has set us up to take.

I believe everything happens for a reason. And Sapphire chose this way and it worked, she isnt breeding them for profit, so this way was best in her eyes. I could understand saying "do whats best for the snake and incubate the eggs" because while shes sitting on the eggs for 60 days, not eating or resting a breeder is losing money hu?

So who is doing whats best for the snakes? Breeders are creating more snakes, when there are millions looking for good homes.....hmmmm. And Sapphire over here is letting her little mama...well be a mama.

No one is wrong and no one is right, to each his own.

---

First of all, it was not Sapphire's snake, it was mine. This is the thread about my clutch... :P Just so there's no confusion there.

Secondly, I am not getting into breeding snakes just to have more in my collection. I am planning on learning more and more and hopefully having more and more successful breedings, and that will include selling offspring. You are right, there are a number of snakes that are not properly cared for or in need of homes, but I think captive breeding can be a better way of having snakes in captivity than catching thousands of wild specimens from the wild, mostly for the snakes' health and success rates of captive bred vs wild caught pets. I don't think that just because there are people out there that do not care for their animals properly, that the people that do should not be able to purchase them from a reliable private breeder.

Lastly, I understand your point about maternal instincts and capabilities. Thanks for your post.

[QUOTE=Sapphire7]

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by jglass38

Try to stop associating your human feelings and needs with that of a snake. QUOTE]

You know everyone has different views in this. No need to re-bring it up.:(

---

I wasn't the one who brought it up again. It was TheAudOne who decided to rekindle the fire and pontificate about all things maternal. :rockon:

This is a good moment, don't you two ruin it by arguing...haha. ;)

I am really happy for you. I want pictures of the babies too. Congratulations and good job.