Big snakes, small enclosures.

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Originally Posted by wilomn

So said by the expert.

Gotcha.

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Cmon now. It feels like your pushing for a shove.

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Originally Posted by Denial

Maybe snap some new pics to post!

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Don't tease me like that Danny! Let's see some of those "underfed" beauties!!

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Originally Posted by stratus_020202

:lockd: Please :)

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no.

There is nothing wrong with debate and discussion.

A full snake is a lazy snake?

Well, it's a load of crap is what it is, literally as well as figuratively.

Lazy is a human condition, not a reptilian one.

A content snake, a snake with no need to be on the hunt, a snake warm and secure is................oh, of course, lazy.

I've no doubt Denial keeps his snakes in good conditions.

I agree that he is not an expert.

I don't keep retics and I am no expert. I am around a friend's retics. They are still pretty active, even within a couple of days after feeding. They are definitely NOT underfed. I know that most pythons and boas tend to be lazy after feeding, but I would not put retics in that category. Just my opinion in my limited experience.

Retics are absolutely more active than burms or rocks.

Is that the topic now?

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Originally Posted by Nate

no.

There is nothing wrong with debate and discussion.

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Agreed.

Does BHB produce absolutely beautiful animals? Yes

Is he a pioneer in the production of beautiful morphs? Yes

Does he genuinely care about his animals? Appears so

However, he is a business, not a "keeper". I can totally understand the need to house his animals the way he does, what I don't agree with is the newbie/inexperienced pet owner thinking that this is the way that snakes should be kept.

I get a lot of grief for my beliefs, not only on this subject either, but in over 30 years of keeping reptiles I have learned a thing or two, and not from "someone else's setups" or "someone's care sheet". I have kept every species of giant snake except for Morelia amethystina, and they all benefit from an enclosure that allows them to do more than curl up.

Here's a suggestion to some of you:

Go into your herp room and look at your snakes after lights out. It's truly amazing what you will see! Of course if all you see is a bunch of tubs that look no different than they did at 1pm then I'm just beating a dead horse here...

And I agree with Denial. If you have a retic in a tub, you are committing animal cruelty.

Chris

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Originally Posted by wilomn

A full snake is a lazy snake?

Well, it's a load of crap is what it is, literally as well as figuratively.

Lazy is a human condition, not a reptilian one.

A content snake, a snake with no need to be on the hunt, a snake warm and secure is................oh, of course, lazy.

I've no doubt Denial keeps his snakes in good conditions.

I agree that he is not an expert.

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Figure of speech, 'brother' <---- also a figure of speech.

"Should" be kept....

"animal cruelty"....

Another expert with another opinion....

It's not news, not to me anyway, that nocturnal snakes, which all snakes with elliptical pupils are as far as I know, more active at night.

Does that mean you who keep them should only feed when it's dark? Isn't it also cruel to make them eat in daylight when they are normally and biologically disposed to feed at night?

Snakes need to eat, thermoregulate and breed. They don't run marathons. They don't live in closets, though many do prefer tight enclosed spaces for long durations, most do not gather socially and none of the species discussed here do at all.

Anthropomorphism.

Bigger is better for us and may induce what appears to be reptilian exercise or exploration but how do we know it's not just a snake looking for a comfy spot to curl up and wait for it's next meal and not the assumed snake out for a slither to visit friends?

I'm not taking either side here as both work.

It's just funny to me that some of you say you don't have a problem with certain things EVEN THOUGH THOSE CERTAIN THINGS ARE WRONG.

Maybe I'm just anthropomorphizing that though.

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Originally Posted by wilomn

"Should" be kept....

"animal cruelty"....

Another expert with another opinion....

It's not news, not to me anyway, that nocturnal snakes, which all snakes with elliptical pupils are as far as I know, more active at night.

Does that mean you who keep them should only feed when it's dark? Isn't it also cruel to make them eat in daylight when they are normally and biologically disposed to feed at night?

Snakes need to eat, thermoregulate and breed. They don't run marathons. They don't live in closets, though many do prefer tight enclosed spaces for long durations, most do not gather socially and none of the species discussed here do at all.

Anthropomorphism.

Bigger is better for us and may induce what appears to be reptilian exercise or exploration but how do we know it's not just a snake looking for a comfy spot to curl up and wait for it's next meal and not the assumed snake out for a slither to visit friends?

I'm not taking either side here as both work.

It's just funny to me that some of you say you don't have a problem with certain things EVEN THOUGH THOSE CERTAIN THINGS ARE WRONG.

Maybe I'm just anthropomorphizing that though.

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Bigger isn't necessarily better but an enclosure that allows a snake to stretch out a bit isn't considered 'big'. IMO