Big News Coming Tomorrow!

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Originally Posted by Bobbafett

The negative opinions are based on what many people have already tried to do with the desert females. So many have died from becoming egg bound, eggs aren't vital, and more issues.

Of course people are going to be skeptical and I'm disappointed they didn't just keep this to themselves until the eggs actually hatched.

So many people are going to try to breed their desert females now and many are going to die!

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The issue regards deaths with Desert females is blown totaly out of context..It is crap...How many females have died due to being egg bound? a handful!, The facts are their is no evidence to support a link between any of the females that have died ..The main issue with Desert females is their apparent inability to produce fertile eggs, the vast majority have simply slugged out...a far cry from the scare mongering brigade that dictate that female deserts will die if bred.
I have been waiting for a fertile clutch to be produced, their are many morphs with issues, apparent infertility issues etc that have gone on to produce.

Please can you provide the figures on how many females have actually died due to breeding?...comments like the above, "so many people are going to breed their desert females now and many are going to die" is complete garbagge..But Hey ho!

It will be interesting to see the results of the clutch

Yes, female deserts can die quite easily due to becoming eggbound, which seems quite common in this morph.

I can't give you an exact number as those who worked with the desert gene usually kept pretty hush hush.
http://www.reptilescanada.com/showth...tion-egg-bound
http://radioactivereptiles.blogspot....roven.html?m=1
http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/foru...=333250&page=2
http://www.captivebredreptileforums....rt-female.html

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Originally Posted by Bobbafett

Yes, female deserts can die quite easily due to becoming eggbound, which seems quite common in this morph.

I can't give you an exact number as those who worked with the desert gene usually kept pretty hush hush.
http://www.reptilescanada.com/showth...tion-egg-bound
http://radioactivereptiles.blogspot....roven.html?m=1
http://www.faunaclassifieds.com/foru...=333250&page=2
http://www.captivebredreptileforums....rt-female.html

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Thanks for the links, I have read every thread out there regards the issue, one female was found to have strictures which were found due to the keeper undertaking a ceasarian on his egg bound female..just the one but suddenly all females had strictures, their have only been a handful of females reported to have died due to being egg bound, no link has been proven to date that any of these females deaths were linked in any way to the one female that had strictures..if I am correct, one of the eggs in the female was a fully formed egg & not a infertile slug.

From the onset I have allways kept an open mind on the subject, away from the forums I have spoken to a number of breeders that feel the same.

I'm not trying to be an ass about this, because I know amir has been in the game far longer than me, but that snake looks like just a citrus pastel to me...

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/07/07/8y6egy6e.jpg
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/07/07/beta4uze.jpg

Comparing these two pics side by side, to my untrained eye, shows that there's no desert in that snake... Once again, just my opinion, but I'm willing to bet money that deserts don't crawl out of those eggs.

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Originally Posted by Mike41793

I'm not trying to be an ass about this, because I know amir has been in the game far longer than me, but that snake looks like just a citrus pastel to me...

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/07/07/8y6egy6e.jpg
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/07/07/beta4uze.jpg

Comparing these two pics side by side, to my untrained eye, shows that there's no desert in that snake... Once again, just my opinion, but I'm willing to bet money that deserts don't crawl out of those eggs.

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I realize you are just giving your 2 cents, so here are mine. Amir, who for one thing actually produced this snake, sees wayyy more snakes than you says this is a citrus pastel desert. Also Brant from Major League Reptiles sees literally hundreds of imports per year and has a vast collection of his own, says that this snake has desert. At least for me, that's enough proof that this snake is what it is claimed to be.

For me, there are still a few questions. One being, does this particular snake not have whatever problem the other desert females have? Second, the babies from this snake, will the females inherit this breedable behaviour? Or is the citrus pastel changing the deserts insides, allowing the snake to produce?

I really don't understand playing devils advocate in this situation. This could be the biggest news to come into the ball world in a long time. Why knock the Op? Also one of the most well known breeders (Amir) has his name and reputation on the line here. I realize that there will always be doubters, but why? How many deserts have you seen? How many pastels have you seen? How many pastel deserts have you seen? Also you are comparing pics which aren't always decisive. You would need to see this snake in person to get a more educated opinion. Amir and the Op have seen the snake. Lets just all wait patiently for these eggs to come out. Then we will have some answers and probly more questions.

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Originally Posted by interloc

I really don't understand playing devils advocate in this situation.

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You must remember,many people like seeing others get beat down. They thrive on playing "devils assvocate"!

I think this is very interesting and will just take a wait and see stance. I am still just a rookie in the BP world but I myself would not have attempted to breed anything with the desert gene in it just because of what has been published on the subject. It is the OP's prerogotive to do as they wish with thier snakes, but choosing to do so, seems to walk the line between bold and foolhardy. Congrats if they have accomplished what others haven't.

I wonder if this line of desert is just different like the variations on Ghost. Just my $0.02

Congrats and I wish all the best to the OP.

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Originally Posted by Mike41793

I'm not trying to be an ass about this, because I know amir has been in the game far longer than me, but that snake looks like just a citrus pastel to me...

http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/07/07/8y6egy6e.jpg
http://img.tapatalk.com/d/13/07/07/beta4uze.jpg

Comparing these two pics side by side, to my untrained eye, shows that there's no desert in that snake... Once again, just my opinion, but I'm willing to bet money that deserts don't crawl out of those eggs.

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Mike,

I'm not trying to be an ass about this either but your post compelled me to reply. In your post you stated "to my untrained eye" I agree on this matter your eye is quite untrained. The animal posted is a Desert. I have owned and bred Deserts and Desert Combos (males) for many many years. Probably as long as Amir! I have a select few Desert combo females that I have kept back to raise slowly, observe AND BREED. I also own Citrus Pastel, Super and Cirturs Yellowbelly animals and none of them would look as crisp and bright as this female in question. I don't know "Cross Exotics" but I am trusting that they have represented themselves honestly here. The neonate photo that you posted above in comparison to the one of the Citrus Pastel (a poorly overcolored photo which looks like it was taken at a reptile show with low K, HPS lights from an overhead warehouse lamp interfering) shows the animals to have very different patterns. Let me try to explain... Notice the head on the Desert in question. The center is an even tone of purple with no really obvious patterning. The non-desert animal would have more of a visible pattern or at least not so even of a tone. Also the cleanliness of the pattern on the Desert with less "keyhole" alien eye stuff going on and a more crisp definition of lines.

On the funny side, we are all artists (an unconventional form of art but artists nonetheless) and sometimes I feel like a painter trying to explain art to someone. Maybe what our TRAINED eyes see is just something that comes from years of understanding our canvas. Please don't label something based on your untrained opinion. Amir is a reputable professional and I really must side with the OP here.

Congrats Cross Exotics! You've given me a glimmer of hope!

Well I say "untrained eye" because i'm not familiar with the desert morph. I'm not a TOTAL noob though, so i think completely disregarding my opinion and saying that i'm wrong just bc Amir and Brant say so is kinda unfair.

I'm willing to bet a $50 donation to BP.net that no desert babies come out of that clutch. Any desert babies hatch and i'll have Judy comment here to confirm I made the donation. I already said I respect all these veterans opinions, so I think you should respect mine too. I'm not saying the snake IS NOT a desert citrus pastel 100% (maybe i didnt make that clear), I'm just saying I don't see it and am willing to bet it isn't.

No harm no foul, we're all just sharing our opinions... :gj: