Scale-less BP photo!

Without the scales, the colors really pop, so to me in that sense I like it. I can only imagine how soft it feels. Maybe like a gecko? If so, that would be bad @** But.. to play devils advocate here..

Nevermind the possible lack of heat pits.. many snakes lack them and eat fine.

The main need for scales are for protection.. I don't see this snake being protected much from burns, bites and scale rot. Yes, its easy to avoid bites by not feeding live.. its easy to prevent scale rot if you clean often and make sure your snake isn't living in wet conditions..

But even the best herper can have equipment failures. Which can cause temp spikes.

I agree, we do play god with them. What are the chances that in the wild you will see a 3,4,5+ mutation ball? To me tho, playing with pattern and colors isn't unethical. Unethical to me is when you take its sole protection away.

I'm sure who ever gets their hands on these expensive snakes will take amazing care of them. But when they become very popular, the average Joe schmoe won't take as much precaution and care. Heaven forbid a live rat gets left in with one. If it balls up, it'll have no protection. Imagine how fast scale rot could happen if someone doesn't know proper humidity?

I personally don't agree with this morph, its amazing looking tho. But to me its sad for the snake to take its main protection away. So its simple. I just won't have one.

That's all I have to say and will say on this subject.

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Originally Posted by Crotalids

I don't have a problem with saying Brian's name, the reason I didn't is because all big breeders at the same. Only care about money and not the animals.

Any individual that bred the spider, and released it to the public is an idiot. The moment where that gene showed head wobbles etc, it should've been stopped, there and then. But no, of course, these guys don't care about the animals like I said, they only care about money.

Who knows what problems these scaleless BP's will have, because they 100% won't be telling you, guess you'll have to find out once they're cheap enough for the public to afford.

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You do know Kevin McCurly founded the spider project not Brian, right?

So if problems come about and Brian shows them publicly, will you come back and admit you were wrong? Assuming the animal can figure out a way to move and eat, what will your take on it be then?

I have a hunch they will not be getting scale rot, just a hunch.

Also I think the average joe argument is a bad one, average joe can do anything to the animal regardless of scales or not.

In addition to the dicussion ill add this: .... imo it doesnt matter if the animal has heat pits, ass long as it can eat a f/t or p/k prey on its own. There are so many other snakes that dont have heat pits and survive quite well. Set that fact aside, Im sure this is just the beginning of Brians project. Since hes proved out the scaleless heads, hes gonna produce more scaless babies. Im sure its gonna be a several year "trial and error" project for him to find out what "works" for those babies. Regardless, Brian is making ball python history. If he can help them survive, and live well, kudos to him. I think its a kewl, very different animal, that is a world apart from all other ball python morphs.

sent from my incubator

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Originally Posted by Kodieh

This high horse you guys are riding, with this false sense of morality you have come up with against the scaleless gene I'm appalled at the entire lot of you.

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This isn't a moral high horse issue. It's you getting butthurt over a snake that isn't yours, hearing facts that you can't argue, and fishing in the abyss hoping you catch something worth saying. So far you haven't come up with anything other than comments against the opponents, not the opposing view.

Personal jabs and name calling make you look childish. You need to at least have some ground to stand on before you go preaching.


Sent From an Enclosure

I think people are freaking out way too early. Its too early to tell if these scaleless BPs will thrive or not. But im willing to wait and see how it goes. As long as the animal can live a normal life in CAPTIVITY then i have no problem with it. None of the morphs we love were meant to survive in the wild. They were made for people to care for them in captivity. Alot of questions will be answered with time. Im not for scaleless BPs or against them. I am neutral until we get more information about how they do in captivity.

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Originally Posted by OhhWatALoser

You do know Kevin McCurly founded the spider project not Brian, right?

So if problems come about and Brian shows them publicly, will you come back and admit you were wrong? Assuming the animal can figure out a way to move and eat, what will your take on it be then?

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I never said Brian founded the spider, I said "Any individual that bred the spider". Couldn't care less who bred it, they are all the same.

I never said these 100% have problems. Your comprehension of English isn't very good is it? I said IF they have problems, they wouldn't tell you. It would lessen the amount of money they will make.

I don't have a problem with all these morphs, i don't like them, I don't understand why people do when there are hundreds of pretty snakes to choose from.

But this is a step in the wrong direction, no scales, no labial pits..what's next? No eyes? 4 heads? 3 tongues? How much longer is this mutilation of an already beautiful animal going to continue?

It seems that one of these guys will be brought to Tinley next weekend, for anyone who will be there. I'm hoping that once more people get to actually see it in person, some of the wild conjecture and fits of moral superiority will subside. I don't think he'd willingly bring it out for tons of people to see in person if he's trying to 'cover up' severe health problems.

Some of the paranoia about TEH BIG EVIL BREEDERZ conspiring with each other to dupe Basement Breeder Joe is a little silly. :rolleyes: It reeks of bitterness and jealousy. But I digress.

So, here's a stupid question.. Do these guys shed?

I think the snake looks neat. And I admit that I do want to touch and feel it. It looks rather soft. However, I don't agree with breeding it or for it.

But who am I to tell someone what they can and cannot do. Its not my business. Just like its no ones business to tell me what I should keep and breed. Im not interested in the scaleless, so I won't be paying much attention to them. I simply don't care enough.
I suggest those who aren't a fan to do the same.

If you like the scaleless, good for you. If you don't like the scaleless, good for you too. The most pointless debate since 'is a lesser different from butter'? Not everyone is going to agree. So just settle with agreeing to disagreeing.

The last scaleless BP survived for 7 or so months before dying out of the blue.
Will these guys will last longer....


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