ECLARK - mites

I bought two BP morphs from Ed Clark (a lemon pastel and a cinny pastel) I'd paid them off awhile ago, and had been waiting for proper weather to have them shipped.

I recieved them this morning, and they were packed well enough, the heat pack was warm and all, though both snakes were in the same snake bag. I've recieved shipments with multiple snakes before and they've always been packed separately in the box.

Anyways, I discovered mites on the snakes, especially on the cinny. As we all know, mites are a great way to spread diseases among collections. Luckily I always keep provent-a-mite on hand so I was able to treat the tubs the snakes are in, but even so, the risk of one or more having escaped the provent-a-mite (ie falling off the snake bag etc before I sprayed the PAM) is real, and I sincerely hope they don't spread to the rest of my collection.

Ed claimed he did not know of the mite infestation, which very well may be true, but I believe you should keep close eye on your animals.. mites are not difficult to spot.

So.. those are my experiences.

That must be very frustrating April to have to deal with. We've been very blessed thus far to never have a mite in our collection and I'm glad you've immediately dealt with what's happened. That last thing you need is your whole collection getting infested with these awful bugs. :( Hope they all stay clear and you got all the mites.

I've had multiple snakes come in from Robin and each was packed properly in seperate snake bags within the shipping box.

2 snakes in the same bag and MITES on morphs!!!!!:mad:

:O I thought i was the only one!

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Originally Posted by CrazyDog

:O I thought i was the only one!

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Say it aint so? Is this a trend. I've only gotten the one from EC.

That sucks April!


In my experiences with Ed, he is a good guy. My snake's (a Cinny and Yellowbelly) came in, well packed and in excellent health. No mites, no injuries, no scars. The snakes were shipped together, but I was notified of this. Both before and after, Ed was very helpful in answering my questions and everything. Sucks they came in with mites. I don't think Ed knew about the mites. You might want to contact him and talk to him about it.

April,

I'm very sorry that you had to experience this, you would hope that using PAM in every collection, especially someone selling as many high dollar morphs as Ed does would be common practice. I hope you're quarantining these new ones, and I'd treat all your established animals as well as a precaution.

Joanna,

Thank you for the compliments!

CrazyDog,

Are you saying you also had mites on snakes you purchased from Ed?

Ed,

Have you offered April any compensation for this?

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Originally Posted by AndrewH

That sucks April!


In my experiences with Ed, he is a good guy. My snake's (a Cinny and Yellowbelly) came in, well packed and in excellent health. No mites, no injuries, no scars. The snakes were shipped together, but I was notified of this. Both before and after, Ed was very helpful in answering my questions and everything. Sucks they came in with mites. I don't think Ed knew about the mites. You might want to contact him and talk to him about it.

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Andrew, just curious, and it may not even be related, but did you get your mites after you got your shipment from Ed?

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Originally Posted by AndrewH

I've used oth Equate and PAM. I've had incredible results with both. I had a mite infestation a little while ago in my Blood Python rack and one of my Ball Python racks, so I moved these racks to the quarantine room, and used equate instead of PAM. To say the least after one treatment with Equate, I haven't seen mites again:D

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Yeesh! That's pretty serious indeed.

Did you contact him about the problem prior to starting this thread?

I got two girls from him last fall, who are just thriving beautifully and no mites present. Just waiting on good weather to ship my pinstripe, although as pretty as the weather is this week, he might be here soon. :-)

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Originally Posted by AndrewH

The snakes were shipped together, but I was notified of this.

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Hmm... I'm not sure why Ed ships snakes together. A new snake bag costs less than a dollar. Seems like a cheap price to reduce stress or possible cannibalism, especially for thousand dollar morphs.

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Originally Posted by rabernet

Andrew, just curious, and it may not even be related, but did you get your mites after you got your shipment from Ed?

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They came in a week or so before the shipment from Ed. I believe on a shipment from LLL Reptile and supply on the Bloods and Ball Pythons I had gotten from them.

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Originally Posted by AndrewH

They came in a week or so before the shipment from Ed. I believe on a shipment from LLL Reptile and supply on the Bloods and Ball Pythons I had gotten from them.

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Ah great, thanks for clearing that up!

Ed, this is serious.

I do not want to spend the type of money that Angolan will cost me if there are mites present in your collection.
I do not have mites and will not expose my animals to them. They can carry all kinds of diseases with them. There is no way I putting my animals at risk of an infestation.
Please address this situation ASAP!

I sent Ed a note asking him to comment on this.


This revelation puts me in a very awkward situation due to a pending deal with him.

Heres the problem with the mites in 1 of my baby racks. I bought a pair of ball python morphs for myself to keep that came from BHB in Michigan about a week and a half ago. gave them a quick soaking then put them into one of my baby racks. I hear today that I sent a ball python to april with mites. was a little surprised because I have never had mites and normally treat everything I buy before its put away. did not expect this coming from Brian Barczyk. long story short, spent the afternoon totally cleaning the rack that had mites in it including new tubs, bedding and scrubbing down the rack with hot soapy bleach water then spraying everything down with Provent-A-Mite. cant remember the last time having mites because I stay on top of it, just goes to show that it can happen to us all and we need to keep a watchful eye. I can assure you it wont happen to me again. :)


Crazydog, Sorry Dude, dont know you and have NEVER sold you a snake!

Are they elimiated?

Where are the angolans?

Were the ones from BHB isolated from the rest of your animal?

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Originally Posted by ECLARK

Heres the problem with the mites in 1 of my baby racks. I bought a pair of ball python morphs for myself to keep that came from BHB in Michigan about a week and a half ago. gave them a quick soaking then put them into one of my baby racks. I hear today that I sent a ball python to april with mites. was a little surprised because I have never had mites and normally treat everything I buy before its put away. did not expect this coming from Brian Barczyk. long story short, spent the afternoon totally cleaning the rack that had mites in it including new tubs, bedding and scrubbing down the rack with hot soapy bleach water then spraying everything down with Provent-A-Mite. cant remember the last time having mites because I stay on top of it, just goes to show that it can happen to us all and we need to keep a watchful eye. I can assure you it wont happen to me again. :)


Crazydog, Sorry Dude, dont know you and have NEVER sold you a snake!

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Have you informed Brian? He is one of the top, most respected breeders in the world and I am sure if there is any truth to this, he would want to know about it and this thread.

You have me confused with someone else. never sold you anything.

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Originally Posted by CrazyDog

:O I thought i was the only one!

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He knows!

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Originally Posted by jglass38

Have you informed Brian? He is one of the top, most respected breeders in the world and I am sure if there is any truth to this, he would want to know about it and this thread.

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Theres 1 rack with 8 babys that are isolated and have been treated with PAM.

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Originally Posted by SPJ

Are they elimiated?

Where are the angolans?

Were the ones from BHB isolated from the rest of your animal?

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Anyone can get a mite infestation, it only takes one to start it. Sounds like everyone has it well in hand. I'd inform Brian too. It doesn't take long for it to get WAY out of hand in a hurry, especially with wood type bedding.
Snake bags can be made so cheap it doesn't bear mentioning really.. $1 yard cotton fabric and a couple minutes to sew it. I have gotten multiple snakes together in one bag. Especially the hatchling females. Never had any issues, but on the rare occasion I have shipped any out, I put one in each bag.
Wolfy

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Originally Posted by CrazyDog

:O I thought i was the only one!

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Are you referring to the fact that you had mites or that Ed sold you a snake that had mites because Ed says he never sold anything to you?

Where April's 2 in that same rack as those other 8?

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Originally Posted by ECLARK

Heres the problem with the mites in 1 of my baby racks. I bought a pair of ball python morphs for myself to keep that came from BHB in Michigan about a week and a half ago. gave them a quick soaking then put them into one of my baby racks.!

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So you don't practice quarantine? Even animals that come from Adam, are quarantined, every animal I bring in is quarantined. You only had these a week and a half and they were put in the same rack with April's established babies?

Also, have you called Brian to inform him that mites came from him, I'm sure he'd like to know, just as you were grateful for April letting you know.

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Originally Posted by ECLARK

I hear today that I sent a ball python to april with mites. was a little surprised because I have never had mites and normally treat everything I buy before its put away. did not expect this coming from Brian Barczyk.

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So, you didn't see any mites at all on these snakes after you soaked them? It takes 30 days for eggs to hatch (give or take).

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Originally Posted by ECLARK

long story short, spent the afternoon totally cleaning the rack that had mites in it including new tubs, bedding and scrubbing down the rack with hot soapy bleach water then spraying everything down with Provent-A-Mite. cant remember the last time having mites because I stay on top of it, just goes to show that it can happen to us all and we need to keep a watchful eye. I can assure you it wont happen to me again. :)

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What compensation have you offered April for this unfortunate predicament she's in now?

Do you NORMALLY practice quarantine, as you didn't with these two, apparently?

Steve, mites are not the end of the world! You eliminate them and hope that you dont have to deal with them again. I did what was needed and hope that they are gone, but will keep a close eye on the situation.


Dont see anything wrong with shipping 2 baby snakes in a LARGE cloth bag. :)

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Originally Posted by SPJ

Are you referring to the fact that you had mites or that Ed sold you a snake that had mites because Ed says he never sold anything to you?

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Snakes with mites.....doesn't quarantine new animals.....ships multiple animals in one bag.

*Checks Ed Clark off list to even consider ever doing business with.*

Yes, and I had no idea there were mites in that rack.

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Originally Posted by lillyorchid

Where April's 2 in that same rack as those other 8?

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Originally Posted by ECLARK

Steve, mites are not the end of the world! You eliminate them and hope that you dont have to deal with them again. I did what was needed and hope that they are gone, but will keep a close eye on the situation.


Dont see anything wrong with shipping 2 baby snakes in a LARGE cloth bag. :)

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Well not exactly true. Mites can pass disease from a sick snake to a healthy one. It is a big problem and one that should never happen. With proper quarantine practices there should be little to no chance of a snake in your permanent collection (or one about to be sold) being exposed to mites.

I don't know Ed nor have I bought anything from him, but I will say that I think some of y'all need to step back from your keyboards and go run around the house or something. Ed didn't purposely send mites... just keep them away form the others until they're gone. :)

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Originally Posted by ECLARK

Yes, and I had no idea there were mites in that rack.

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Ed - what about quarantine? This is really disturbing!

You don't quarentine all those snakes you buy to sell?
If so, that is really really super scary!

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Originally Posted by Sausage

I don't know Ed nor have I bought anything from him, but I will say that I think some of y'all need to step back from your keyboards and go run around the house or something. Ed didn't purposely send mites... just keep them away form the others until they're gone. :)

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Sausage - he also admits that he didn't quarantine new animals, which someone who is sending out so many animals most certainly should be doing.

If April could clearly see mites right away, how did Ed miss them when preparing them to ship?

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Originally Posted by Sausage

I don't know Ed nor have I bought anything from him, but I will say that I think some of y'all need to step back from your keyboards and go run around the house or something. Ed didn't purposely send mites... just keep them away form the others until they're gone. :)

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It's no longer about the mites, it's about him sticking new bought snakes in with his other ones with out quarantining them properly. Mites are a big deal and can spread and get out of hand if not taken care of as soon as they are spotted.

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Originally Posted by rabernet

Sausage - he also admits that he didn't quarantine new animals....how did Ed miss them when preparing them to ship?

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Sorry, I must've missed that post. :oops: Yeah, I see what you mean. I think Ed owes April *some* compensation... maybe some PAM or something. :D

Quarentining is good! I think Ed can learn a leeson from this. :colbert:

Ed, it IS a big deal to me when a $1000 plus animal may have been exposed to mites. What if mites get onto that Angolan after being on an import? It could happen.
You had mites spread from tub to tub and from a new arrival to an established animal that was already sold and being held for a customer.

Just the thought of this makes me worry.

it is an issue, but im sure Ed got all the feedback he needs and will take it into consideration..lets give him a break a bit because he definitely is a good breeder and a nice guy. it's how life is-you make mistakes and you learn from them

:rockon: :rockon: :rockon:

Ed, put my mind at ease. Please spray the tub with that angolan in it so I can stop worrying.

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Originally Posted by Beardo

Snakes with mites.....doesn't quarantine new animals.....ships multiple animals in one bag.

*Checks Ed Clark off list to even consider ever doing business with.*

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Don't just jump into conclusions that Ed is a horrible breeder. This is the only thread that I have seen that shows something wrong with the way he does things. It was an honest mistake. He didn't notice mites on his animals. It was treated.

Ed, what happens when you potentially infect one of your customer's collections with IBD carried by a mite?

You just going to say "its no big deal....I didn't know"?

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Originally Posted by adi

it is an issue, but im sure Ed got all the feedback he needs and will take it into consideration..lets give him a break a bit because he definitely is a good breeder and a nice guy. it's how life is-you make mistakes and you learn from them

:rockon: :rockon: :rockon:

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Adi, not quarantining is NOT a mistake that someone makes, especially someone with the years of experience that Ed has. That should be the FIRST thing that's done with any new addition, not put into a rack with established (and sold) animals.

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Originally Posted by Beardo

Ed, what happens when you potentially infect one of your customer's collections with IBD carried by a mite?

You just going to say "its no big deal....I didn't know"?

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What else is there to do? He sent some mites with the snakes unknowingly, they got on the snake and transfered the desease. I dought he will say NO BIG DEAL. And if a mite carrys IBD and gives it to someone elses snake it sure has already spread to Eds snakes.

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Originally Posted by stangs13

Don't just jump into conclusions that Ed is a horrible breeder. This is the only thread that I have seen that shows something wrong with the way he does things. It was an honest mistake. He didn't notice mites on his animals. It was treated.

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:frustrate QUARANTINE - do you guys honestly believe not having quarantine practices in place is NOT a big deal?

I admit I was a bit suprised to see a thread of this nature pop up here Ed. It will be telling to see how all is handled.

Well on a good note, I still plan on doing business with Ed, this is the first bad thing ive heard of him, however like someone said earlier this could happen to anyone.... I havent bought anything from him , but i plan on it.... :2cent:

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Originally Posted by stangs13

What else is there to do? He sent some mites with the snakes unknowingly, they got on the snake and transfered the desease. I dought he will say NO BIG DEAL. And if a mite carrys IBD and gives it to someone elses snake it sure has already spread to Eds snakes.

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Justin, he already did:

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Steve, mites are not the end of the world!

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That translates to no big deal to me.

No one says he has IBD, but IBD CAN be carried by mites, so having mites is a BIG deal.

His lack of quarantine is a bigger one.

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Originally Posted by Beardo

Ed, what happens when you potentially infect one of your customer's collections with IBD carried by a mite?

You just going to say "its no big deal....I didn't know"?

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for the record i recieved balls from mike willbank. they were packed 5 to a bag. and they weathered the trip fine.

and on the topic of ibd. if they do have it, it is not like with boas where they dont even show signs of ibd for months. balls die form ibd relly quick.

i agree that this is a problem that should of been handaled privetly first.
also this is the first time i have ever herd of a negative transaction with ed.

i guarentee that there is not a single person in here with more than 100 snakes that has not had a mit or two at one time or another.

i have herd of stories of people going to reptile shows and coming home and then three days later they have a out of know where mite infestion.

and i do feal ed owes some compensation. like a new can of pam.

but if down the road other snakes fall sick then the real compensaiton comes in

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Originally Posted by MATT FISHER REPTILES

i guarentee that there is not a single person in here with more than 100 snakes that has not had a mit or two at one time or another.

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I have over 500 ball pythons and have never had a single mite in my collection.

Hope this helps.

-adam

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Originally Posted by rabernet

Justin, he already did:



That translates to no big deal to me.

No one says he has IBD, but IBD CAN be carried by mites, so having mites is a BIG deal.

His lack of quarantine is a bigger one.

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it doesn't to me. No big deal means that I can just forget aobut it.

But not bieng the end of the world doesn't mean it is a good thing.

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Originally Posted by Adam_Wysocki

I have over 500 ball pythons and have never had a single mite in my collection.

Hope this helps.

-adam

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Wow!!

Not even on WC animals?

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Originally Posted by stangs13

Wow!!

Not even on WC animals?

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No, never.

Snake mites are not found on WC or CH animals that are imported from West Africa.

-adam