Double Het For What?

Well, this was supposed to be a simple pairing, het Albino het Pied x het Albino het Pied. Nothing to crazy. Was a little disappointed when I got Albinos, but no Pieds. But when I looked more closely, I saw 2 that were not normal either. Since they do not look like their normal looking parents, I am assuming that this is another recessive gene. I have contacted a very well known and respected breeder, and he agrees, that while these 2 share some characteristics with Caramel Albino and Hypo, neither gene is what they are. Both he and I are not sure what this unknown recessive gene may be. So, I am posting this, hoping that someone else might have some insight. Thanks.

Clutch in Eggs (Unknown Recessive Animals Next to Albinos):
http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file..._eggs_comp.jpg


The Albinos:
http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...14-08-17_1.jpg
http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...14-08-17_4.jpg


Partial Group Shot (2 Albinos, 2 Normal Looking, and 1 Unknown Recessive, Smaller Normal Looking Had Not Shed at Time of Picture):
http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...4-08-17_15.jpg


One of Each (Unknown Recessive is Bottom Right):
http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...14-08-17_6.jpg


Unknown Recessive (left) and Normal Looking Sibling (right):
http://ball-pythons.net/gallery/file...14-08-17_8.jpg

So does this mean the parents are triple hets? lol It's a subtle gene/ color mutation if that's what it is. I do like how bright it is. Where did you get the parents?

first thing i can think of is fire/vanilla.....these can be very subtle morphs and maybe one of the parents was a vanilla or fire that went unnoticed.
this could happen if one of the grand parents was a vanilla/fire albino, very hard to ID that one. something like this could have happened: breeder sold a fire/vanilla albino as a regular albino due to ID issue, then next breeder thinks he's breeding a regular albino to a pied, hatches out a fire/vanilla double het albino pied, thinks it as a normal DH albino pied because he's not expecting anything extra...you breed it and notice the odd balls....very complicated explanation with a lot of maybes, but it's more rational and has better odds of happening than triple hets...

Quote:

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Originally Posted by alan12013

So does this mean the parents are triple hets? lol It's a subtle gene/ color mutation if that's what it is. I do like how bright it is. Where did you get the parents?

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Not too sure what this means. They maybe triple hets and I just had really bad odds on the Pied stuff, or they may have been mislabeled double hets. I got them from a friend who got them in a trade. My friend had to get out of Ball Pythons because of a medical condition, and in the chaos of that transition, a lot of his records got mixed up or lost. I was hoping to prove the pair as double het Albino-Pied, but now I have another mystery on my hands.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by J.P.

first thing i can think of is fire/vanilla.....these can be very subtle morphs and maybe one of the parents was a vanilla or fire that went unnoticed.
this could happen if one of the grand parents was a vanilla/fire albino, very hard to ID that one. something like this could have happened: breeder sold a fire/vanilla albino as a regular albino due to ID issue, then next breeder thinks he's breeding a regular albino to a pied, hatches out a fire/vanilla double het albino pied, thinks it as a normal DH albino pied because he's not expecting anything extra...you breed it and notice the odd balls....very complicated explanation with a lot of maybes, but it's more rational and has better odds of happening than triple hets...

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I understand your theory, but if you look at my thread for locks for the 2013-2014 season (http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...ry-Balls-Locks), I think you'll agree that neither parent has Fire, nor Vanilla in them. I will try posting some comparison pictures tonight, after work.

My first thought is OG but not sure :confusd::confusd:

Ya same here they really look like some sort or ghost. The color of the head compared to the normal is a huge indicator.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by PitOnTheProwl

My first thought is OG but not sure :confusd::confusd:

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Quote:

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Originally Posted by alan12013

Ya same here they really look like some sort or ghost. The color of the head compared to the normal is a huge indicator.

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I know what you guys mean. At first I thought that it was another line of Hypo, and it may be, but it is not like the Hypo I am working with. I've gotten my Hypo animals from Adam Chesla and Outback Reptiles. I've produced Hypos, Pastel Hypos, Hypos het for Pied, and Pastel Hypos het for Pied, and this looks different from all of those. The color is different, and more importantly, the boldness or intensity of the black on the body is different. I'm going to take some pictures tonight, after work, to show this.

Unrelated, but I read your thread title in the tune of "TURN DOWN FOR WHAT!"

....carry on.

The lack of blushing is thowing me.
have they shed out yet?