BPs in bioreactive vivaria?

So I've seen a few people mention keeping BPs in vivariums, and I searched the forums for "vivarium" but didn't see much relevant on the first page.

I currently have two extremely involved vivariums, both with sumps, intense filtration, lots of live plants, and terrestrial, aquatic, and vermiculate (spelling--worms!) animals. One is a vaguely south east asian swamp, and the other is a stream-side enclosure for my spengeri.

So anyway, I'm really into this stuff. But it doesn't seem to make a ton of sense to me for BPs to live in vivaria. The main issue being that BP excrement is not exactly what I'd want in my compost pile. In my other tanks there are things that eat the poop and I don't have to clean up so much, outside of regular water and filter maintenance. Also, turtles and frogs are happy being all muddy and gunky and having bugs and anthropods (which they eat) crawling around, whereas it seems helpful to keep snakes clean.

And in most vivaria, it'd be impossible to sterilize the way we do when doing regular tank cleanings for BPs.

So who actually does this? And how? (Feel free to link me to other threads I didn't find.)

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Originally Posted by dkspftw

So I've seen a few people mention keeping BPs in vivariums, and I searched the forums for "vivarium" but didn't see much relevant on the first page.

I currently have two extremely involved vivariums, both with sumps, intense filtration, lots of live plants, and terrestrial, aquatic, and vermiculate (spelling--worms!) animals. One is a vaguely south east asian swamp, and the other is a stream-side enclosure for my spengeri.

So anyway, I'm really into this stuff. But it doesn't seem to make a ton of sense to me for BPs to live in vivaria. The main issue being that BP excrement is not exactly what I'd want in my compost pile. In my other tanks there are things that eat the poop and I don't have to clean up so much, outside of regular water and filter maintenance. Also, turtles and frogs are happy being all muddy and gunky and having bugs and anthropods (which they eat) crawling around, whereas it seems helpful to keep snakes clean.

And in most vivaria, it'd be impossible to sterilize the way we do when doing regular tank cleanings for BPs.

So who actually does this? And how? (Feel free to link me to other threads I didn't find.)

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We compromise... We create the look of a vibrant viv using plastic things and spend extra time cleaning it. So yeah, 6 snakes for me is almost to the max. I can maybe add 2 more but that's about it. I don't want to spend the entire Saturday cleaning!

People in the UK refer to "enclosures" as "vivariums". They don't mean a planted viv as we know it

I've known a few people who have attempted it, but I can't think of anyone who has continued with a naturalistic vivarium long term with any type of snake not just ball pythons. I love the looks of a natural looking vivarium with frogs or small lizards, but any kind of snake will tear the place up burrowing through the substrate, crushing plants under their weight or stinking it up with their copius amount of waste. I'm sure it HAS been done successfully, I'm also sure that it's probably a LOT of work which I don't think is the idea behind a bioreactive vivarium.

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Originally Posted by Rickys_Reptiles

People in the UK refer to "enclosures" as "vivariums". They don't mean a planted viv as we know it

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Yes (I'm a member of the theroyalpythons forum). If a display has a live animal in it, it is called a vivarium even if it has nothing else but the animal. Lots of people in the US also do the "UK-type" viv.

But the OP is asking about bioreactive vivs.

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Originally Posted by anatess

We compromise... We create the look of a vibrant viv using plastic things and spend extra time cleaning it. So yeah, 6 snakes for me is almost to the max. I can maybe add 2 more but that's about it. I don't want to spend the entire Saturday cleaning!

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Oy. That sounds not-fun. Haha. Yeah, I figured some might do this. While I also like a naturalistic look, I've settled on ignoring my substrate and using real rocks as hides. I just spray them all with a sealant before putting them in so that I can effectively clean the porous ones. It sort of creates a cool desert look. I use lace rock and some slate.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by anatess

Yes (I'm a member of the theroyalpythons forum). If a display has a live animal in it, it is called a vivarium even if it has nothing else but the animal. Lots of people in the US also do the "UK-type" viv.

But the OP is asking about bioreactive vivs.

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That's true, but it does seem likely now that most of the people I've seen mention it were not talking about bioreactive ones. So maybe I just got that idea in my head.

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Originally Posted by dkspftw

That's true, but it does seem likely now that most of the people I've seen mention it were not talking about bioreactive ones. So maybe I just got that idea in my head.

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Ahh! So Ricky_Reptiles was right. You thought the vivs bp people are talking about are bioreactive ones. Sorry. I thought you saw the regular vivs and saw the bio-reactive vivs and wanted to try your hand at the bio...

So, if it's just naturalistic look you want, then yeah, loads of people - especially in the UK - have tons of ideas. My avatar is one of my vivs.

Quote:

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Originally Posted by anatess

Ahh! So Ricky_Reptiles was right. You thought the vivs bp people are talking about are bioreactive ones. Sorry. I thought you saw the regular vivs and saw the bio-reactive vivs and wanted to try your hand at the bio...

So, if it's just naturalistic look you want, then yeah, loads of people - especially in the UK - have tons of ideas. My avatar is one of my vivs.

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Yeah, no I mean I'm not really considering changing my current setup but this post was pure curiosity. I'm really really into bioreactive vivs, and I figured it could possibly be a future option. But now I'm thinking probably not. 8)

People have done it successfully, but it requires waste removal, and extremely tough plants, lol. I'm planning on getting into bioreactive vivaria myself, soon, and my BP's are NOT going in there. :P

at my local zoo, they have a BEAUTIFUL reptile vivarium. absolutely amazing.

glass from floor to ceiling, a large 4 feet deep underwater area with fish and two crocodiles (dont know the species, not too large), with stone platforms that have infrared light where two green anacondas like to hang out. then a land areas where some tortoises live. all connected, all providing for the different needs of the anacondas, tortoises and alligators, living plants underwater, and at the shore. and in the land section its more sandy and desert like but again with plants. they do have a natural stone barrier preventing the tortoises from going to the shore, but the anacondas and crocs are free to move.

its really a dream, half aquarium half terrarium with 3 huge reptile species: anacodas, big land turtles, and crocs. i dont know how much research they put into it, must have been a lot, but its working. when i go there, i see the same animals each time, without injuries, so somehow its working. the fact that its really big surely plays a role here. i really wonder how they keep the anacondas and crocs from fighting each other.

so, i would say.... i dont know how it fits BPs, but i think it can be done, it just might be massively expensive to get it done right. the one at the zoo is a walk-in enclosure with carmouflaged doors and the glass is really thick. Its not too relevant to the thread, but i wanted to share it anyway because its the most amazing reptile vivarium i have ever seen and i dont think i will see any other enclosure like it anytime soon. But its a large zoo with seemingly infinite funds, sloths freely climb around 20 feet above in the hippo enclosure, they have weaver birds actually weaving and breeding, it may be quite impossible for a private person to do stuff like that.