Crazy genetic question but I think it works

Hey y'all

So correct me if I am wrong, this is just a theory. If I were to breed 100% piebald het cinnamon to a 100% piebald black pastel would the babies come out as possible piebalds, super black (solid black), lower percentage het normals, cinnamon, and black pastels? Also what are my chances of getting a piebald and what kind would it be? What are my chances of a super black , I heard 1/4 percent? I've given this a lot of thought haha. Fill me in guys :)

Thanks!

Here you go: http://www.worldofballpythons.com/wi...female=33,83:1

umm, cinnamon is codominant, black pastel is also codominant. so there is no such thing as "het cinnamon" or "het black pastel", instead you have a super form.

with a recessive like pebald, you can either have te visual form, or the hets, which look like normals.

so, let me try to interpret what you said....

its a cinnamon 100% het pied to a black pastel 100% het pied.

the calculator says this:

Male:	Cinnamon, Het Piebald
Female:	Black Pastel, Het Piebald
Percent	Fraction	Traits
6.25%	1/16	Piebald, 8 Ball
6.25%	1/16	Piebald, Cinnamon
6.25%	1/16	Piebald, Black Pastel
6.25%	1/16	Piebald
12.5%	1/8	8 Ball, Het Piebald
12.5%	1/8	Cinnamon, Het Piebald
12.5%	1/8	Black Pastel, Het Piebald
12.5%	1/8	Het Piebald
6.25%	1/16	8 Ball
6.25%	1/16	Cinnamon
6.25%	1/16	Black Pastel
6.25%	1/16	Normal
View Results Page

but since you cannot differentiate between het pied and the ones that are not het pied, apart from the pieds, you get:

18.75% = 3/16 8 ball 66% possible het pied
18.75% = 3/16 cinnamon 66% possible het pied
18.75% = 3/16 black pastel 66% possible het pied
18.75% = 3/16 normal 66% possible het pied


and yes the 8-ball piebald would qualify as a panda pied, just with a very dark brown instead of black (normally panda pied is a super black pastel pied, not an 8-ball).

Thank you so much! I think I am going to invest in these two snakes if I can find them!!! :gj:

Technically a Cinnamon IS heterozygous for cinnamon and super is homozygous for cinnamon. Since it's a co-dominant mutation this just means the heterozygous genotype expresses the phenotype. They are still both heterozygous (1 copy) and homozygous (2 copies). The difference with a recessive gene is just that it only expresses the phenotype when it is homozygous in genotype.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by MrLang

Technically a Cinnamon IS heterozygous for cinnamon and super is homozygous for cinnamon. Since it's a co-dominant mutation this just means the heterozygous genotype expresses the phenotype. They are still both heterozygous (1 copy) and homozygous (2 copies). The difference with a recessive gene is just that it only expresses the phenotype when it is homozygous in genotype.

---

that is correct, but in the common usage of words there is no such thing as a "100% het cinnamon" because the word "het" is only ever used when talking about recessives. There is a heterozygous cinnamon called a cinnamon, but there is no "het cinnamon", because that would imply that you get a cinnamon by breeding two normal looking "het cinnamon" together. and thats not correct.

its linguistics, but strictly speaking "het" is a different word with a different meaning and different common usage compared to the more precise "heterozygous". "hets" are supposed to look normal, maybe with some kind of markers maybe without. You can find a context where it makes sense to talk about a "heterozygous spider", but the term "100% het spider" never makes sense.

Hey guys? I think you misunderstood my question. I said PIEBALD HET Cinnamon and black pastel meaning they would carry the piebald gene in them and when bred together I should have a chance at producing a panda, super black, and piebald among the lower percentage of het black pastels and cinnys. Make sense?

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by freedom21

Hey guys? I think you misunderstood my question. I said PIEBALD HET Cinnamon and black pastel meaning they would carry the piebald gene in them and when bred together I should have a chance at producing a panda, super black, and piebald among the lower percentage of het black pastels and cinnys. Make sense?

---

Well that's really not the way the term het is generally used. I understood what you meant but the "het" should go before the morph in question, as in het piebald, het clown, het albino. What you said generally would imply a visual piebald, het cinnamon which as was pointed out isn't correct.

Ah gotcha, didn't know there was a creation placement. Now that we are all on the same page, do you guys think its a good idea to breed the two? I would like to find a breeder that may have them? I know its probably not too common, and any idea how much these het might cost?

There is a lot of potential with this pairing, certainly worth doing.

I haven't seen many of these around, and they will probably be pretty expensive. It might be a better plan to pickup a male visual pied, a female cinnamon, and a female black pastel and make some yourself.