Leopard : Not Allelic?

Despite the trend of people proving out their leopards to be het pied and still I have yet to hear of someone proving one not to be het pied. Looks like a lot of people got lucky. http://forums.kingsnake.com/view.php?id=2017839,2017839

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In 2013 we bred a Spider Piebald (from a Leopard x Spider Leopard breeding theorizing that is was a Super Leopard) to 3 females for a total of 23 eggs. None of the offspring were Leopard. We are now convinced that the Leopard gene and the Piebald gene can be separated.

To further support our theory we have been made aware of 2 other Super Leopards that were not Piebalds. One of which is owned by Markus Jayne and was proven after producing 5 clutches with 100% of the offspring displaying the Leopard trait.

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Looks like it is just another dominant trait. Kinda interesting how that pied gene stuck along those leopards for so long. Also he brought up the value of them at the end of the post. I wonder do you think Leopard het pieds will increase in value or just the regular leopards will decrease with this new info? Leopard no doubt does some pretty cool things regardless.

how if it produced a super is it not an incomplete dominant trait?

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Originally Posted by snakesRkewl

how if it produced a super is it not an incomplete dominant trait?

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The heterozygous and homozygous forms look the same, that is the definition of dominant.

Besides being sexed linked on the w chromosome or something actually preventing the snakes from reproducing, such as desert females fertility issues or homozgyous lethal animals, everything should have a super form.

Dominant, Inc-dom, Co-dom, recessive are just classifcation based off how the animal looks in heterozgyous/homozygous form. Genetics still works the same no matter what you call it.

I would like to see these two side by side, has greg released any pics showing they look the same?

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Originally Posted by snakesRkewl

I would like to see these two side by side, has greg released any pics showing they look the same?

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not that I know of, I would be interested also.

Interesting that not much has been said about this?

hmmm... Brian from BHB had a "super pinstripe" that produced nothing but pins long enough to convince him it was homozygous. turned out not to be. just crazy odds. interesting though. in the writing he keeps mentioning "separating" the leopard gene from the piebald. i was under the impression that the leopard gene WAS a piebald gene. just a more visual het form of one.

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Originally Posted by TheSnakeGeek

hmmm... Brian from BHB had a "super pinstripe" that produced nothing but pins long enough to convince him it was homozygous. turned out not to be. just crazy odds. interesting though. in the writing he keeps mentioning "separating" the leopard gene from the piebald. i was under the impression that the leopard gene WAS a piebald gene. just a more visual het form of one.

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where'd ya hear that, because I've never heard that from Brian.

Some people don't get heavily into the genetics stuff, for some reason linked genes seem to be easier to understand than allelic genes, they function the same for the conversation most people have so it works I guess. Just the odds and some mechanics are the problem, but most people don't get into that far.

I did said greg and email also, hopefully he gets back to me

take it with a grain of salt, because part of it is hearsay. lol but i kept hearing rumors all over the place that brian had a super pinstripe. not sure if people were just repeating what they read someone else say on forums or if there was any truth to it. then someone eventually told me there was an old interview with brian about it. not sure if it was on herp herp hooray or where. i searched for it for a while but never found it. supposedly on the interview brian said he had a pinstripe that produced some crazy number of nothing but pins over the years and he believed it to be a "super." i was kinda skeptical, so i asked brian about it and he said there was no "super pin." so IF the rumors were true and there was an interview with brian saying this, then he murdered some odds and later found out it wasn't a super.

it's interesting though. i was planning on doing some leopard x pied breedings eventually. i guess time will tell. lol

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Originally Posted by TheSnakeGeek

so i asked brian about it and he said there was no "super pin."

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Very interesting, I have also asked Brian the same thing and was told the opposite. The story right form his mouth was 23 eggs all pins and that he no longer had the animal. Whether it died or was sold I have no idea. He even showed me some females that he said were possible super pins.

I think my female pin reabsorbed, I was disappointed. But ill be trying the same pairing next year, hopefully I can try to prove out some super pins eventually.