Breeder rep or looks?

I'm trying to start my collection and I want to be sure I have the right snakes for quality offspring, but I've run into a dilemma (real surprising since I'm a newb, huh?). I see really good looking snakes (from what I know) at sometimes much cheaper prices than the big breeders, but that could easily be a fluke that some beginner popped out, and then you look in big breeder sites and you'll see much uglier snakes but you know their gene-pool make quality snakes (the one offered that are a bit off are probably just the occasional ugly-duckling, so to speak). Now, producing quality animals is the most important thing, and I will wait a little longer to save up if I have to (I am on a budget), so what do you guys think is the best way for me to go?

Supporting any reputable breeder in this hobby is a good thing. If they have good quality animals but aren't "big", why hesitate? I wouldn't do business with someone who has a bad rep, and always check fauna BOI before doing business, but I know plenty of small time breeders with top of the line animals....

Well just because an animal isnt from BHB or Davis or NERD dosnt mean it's not worth buying. If you see a good example of a morph from a small breeder that looks great and the price is good then get it. Also just because a snake is pretty dosnt mean it will pass on it's beauty. You see this a lot in the pastel morphs. You can have a yellow as can be sire and dam that produce browned out babies. If you want to buy from the big breeders that's fine. I'm not telling you not to. But on some morphs you could buy just as nice of an animal from a small breeder. Honestly most of the time when you buy from the big boys your buying the name, not so much the morph.

Most of my balls I have gotten from breeders whom are really right in the middle of the tiers. IMHO. I don't want to buy a name if that animal Isnt the best quality animal.
I look for an animal that represents the morph the best in my eyes or has a certain quality I'm looking for. Sometimes the middle and smaller guys have a better higher quality animal. Sometimes not. I look for sellers that also have ethics, show pride in their animals and enjoy this hobby as much as I do.


Check out what's new on my website... www.Homegrownscales.com

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Originally Posted by Amon Ra Reptiles

Well just because an animal isnt from BHB or Davis or NERD dosnt mean it's not worth buying. If you see a good example of a morph from a small breeder that looks great and the price is good then get it. Also just because a snake is pretty dosnt mean it will pass on it's beauty. You see this a lot in the pastel morphs. You can have a yellow as can be sire and dam that produce browned out babies. If you want to buy from the big breeders that's fine. I'm not telling you not to. But on some morphs you could buy just as nice of an animal from a small breeder. Honestly most of the time when you buy from the big boys your buying the name, not so much the morph.

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That's kinda my dilemma. I'm by no means in a hurry to flush an extra $1-200 down the drain just for a name, but like you said, you could get a gorgeous snake and get a bunch of ugly omes out of it, and my whole thing was that is it worth it to spend more because it's much less likely to happen with the bigger name guys stock.

The big names weren't always big names. They were new breeders with top of the line gorgeous animals. People bought from them despite being relatively unknown and through good interactions and producing more beautiful animals, their reputations grew :)

The newer guys might not have the names, but who knows, they might be a big name someday, if they are producing awesome animals and have good business practices. If you talk to the guy and like him and really like the snake, I'd say go for it. We all have to start somewhere. :D

Someday when I have the money I want to get a very high end pastel to work on higher quality pastel combos. Right now the only pastels I've seen that have been to the standard I want have been from NERD, but if I saw one that was jaw droppingly gorgeous from a new breeder, sure I would probably buy from them--as long as the breeder didn't have a 'BAD' reputation!

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Originally Posted by Homegrownscales

Most of my balls I have gotten from breeders whom are really right in the middle of the tiers. IMHO. I don't want to buy a name if that animal Isnt the best quality animal.
I look for an animal that represents the morph the best in my eyes or has a certain quality I'm looking for. Sometimes the middle and smaller guys have a better higher quality animal. Sometimes not. I look for sellers that also have ethics, show pride in their animals and enjoy this hobby as much as I do.


Check out what's new on my website... www.Homegrownscales.com

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I've seen a couple guys that are a little more expensive, but you can see they've put out some really quality. high-end stuff, while still having real nice basic morphs, so they must be doing something right...this is probably where I'll end up.

This brings up another question though. take Wilbanks for example (he's all over this site), he sells all his morph/sex at one price. Well naturally all the pretty ones get snatched up first, but my question would be that since I really don't care if it's the most beautiful snake since its just for breeding would getting the "ugly duckling" of the batch still put out the same quality offspring as his prettier siblings??

I feel you on your dilemma I am an upstart producing animals in the 1k price range, and dont have a big name. I am not gonna give away my animals, but who is gonna trust me, my pics show the qulity of animal I have but who knows that I actually have it..

I am doing alot of trading, and giving out refferals to get my name out there, there are alot of us that dont have a big name, but our animals are high quality... For example, I put my black pewters up for sale, they were in the middle of what people were asking higher than the low, lower than the high, but these were awesom looking pewters no one really seemed interested, I called a bigger name to trade, he saw the pics and said he would be glad to resell them and I got a great trade.

That being said there are alot of us here that dont have huge names, but great animals. If you try an unknown person, keep records of the comunication from begining to end, I prefer talking on the phone you get to know someone better in my oppenion, but I fallow up phone calls with emails so I have documentation. People dont survive long in this buisness if they screw others over, especially if those people speak out

I would go with looks before rep. On that same note if I was going with a new breeder or a small time breeder I would try to find someone local so I can pick the animal up. So I know that is coming from a good home, and not one where it is under fed or housed in dirty cages.

That can swing both ways..............................

If its a visual..................always go by looks first.
IF its a het................. Rep will always play a HUGE part;)

To answer your second question: I would think one or two ugly snakes could pop out some hot holdbacks but is it really worth the chance??