Erythriphores in ball pythons discussion

[PythonWallace]

This thread is for the discussion of any facts or opinions about the presence of red pigment in ball pythons. It is commonly accepted that ball pythons only have the ability to produce varying degrees of melanin and xanthaphores, but what do you know about red pigment in balls?

Here is a scale I made that shows the possible color combinations that can be made from only melanin and xanthaphores. A lot of the cinnamon, burgundy, orange, lavenders, etc., are not shown in the 2 color scale.


This is a scale that uses a max of 25% red and 25% black pigments. It is very limited, and does not nearly show all the possible combinations of only melanin and erythriphores, but it does seem to show some of the colors that can be seen in morphs like the snow, queen bee, soul-sucker, woma/lesser/pastel, LA, spider, etc., that can't be found in the above scale.


Finally is a scale that lays the 25% red scale over the complete black and yellow scale. This also only shows a fraction of the possibilities of the 3-color combinations, but it shows a lot more of the cinnamon and orange colors found in many ball pythons. There's the burnt orange found in ringers and pieds, the cinnamon's and burgundy's colors, the bright oranges seen in albino clowns, etc.


So what's going on? Let's see some data and hear some opinions.

[wilomn]

Very clearly, you have far too much extra time on your hands.

[PythonWallace]

I forgot to include my theories here.

1. There is a small amount of erythriphores in ball ball pythons from about 0% - 30%.

2.Xanthiphores are usually present in smaller degrees, but is occasionally found, in certain mutations and combos, in a hyper-xanthic appearance. In these instances some or all of the xanthiphores take on a red and orange hues similar to what yellow food coloring looks like before it's diluted.

I don't think that #2 would explain a lot of the colors that were named in my second scale.

I'm sure I'm butchering the spelling of these terms, but dictionary.com doesn't have them listed.

[PythonWallace]

Very clearly, you have far too much extra time on your hands.

Yep. Probably almost as much as you.

[PythonWallace]

Maybe if I stopped using my free time for productive things and used it to go through all the threads I have no interest in, leaving off topic replies, taking shots at people and making mongrel snakes I could make as many friends as you do, Wes. I wish I had that kind of time, and ego, and integrity.

[wolfy-hound]

Wow, it seemed like a cool conversation, but I think I'll chat on some other thread without the potshots and griping. Thanks for the scales and ideas anyway.

[DutchHerp]

I don't see how this is wasting your time... I think it's interesting and want to hear some opinions too.

Where did you hear this?

It is commonly accepted that ball pythons only have the ability to produce varying degrees of melanin and xanthaphores?

[PythonWallace]

I don't see how this is wasting your time... I think it's interesting and want to hear some opinions too.

Where did you hear this?

It is commonly accepted that ball pythons only have the ability to produce varying degrees of melanin and xanthaphores?

Well, it just seemed like these are the only two pigments commonly mentioned when it comes to balls. There are amelanistic and axanthic balls, but like Tim Bailey said in another thread that there is no mention of anery balls. I just don't ever see anyone mentioning erythriphore, or anyone working with selectively breeding for high red balls when that is usually a common thing in species that have erythrispore as an option to work with.

[wilomn]

I must apologize. I don't use smileys and I forgot that sometimes I come across as other than I meant.

It was in jest.

I actually think it's pretty cool.

I honestly did not mean anything negative.

You have my most humble and abject apology for the unintended insult.

[PythonWallace]

I must apologize. I don't use smileys and I forgot that sometimes I come across as other than I meant.

It was in jest.

I actually think it's pretty cool.

I honestly did not mean anything negative.

You have my most humble and abject apology for the unintended insult.

Thanks for clarifying. I got carried away with my post, so sorry for that.