How to start a breeding project?

[fishman]

To start out i am a person who loves animals (with the exception of rodents.) I work at a small pet shop and i really like the ball pythons. When doing some research i came across all of the different ball python morphs, and wow those are nicer then most fish, and you can touch them. I have been thinking and have been doing a lot of research on the snakes and would like to start a small breeding program. I understand i will have to wait about 2 years to start the actual breeding but am wondering how to start. I have about $1000 and $450 per month after that coming from my job that i am willing to spend. I really like the bumblebees and i was thinking of possibly buying some female pastels this year and next year buying a male bumblebee and the year after that try to breed them. I have just about nothing beside some spare fish stuff and am wondering how to start a small program and how much you would think it would cost. I was thinking of a small rat colony and a small rack system for the snakes. If you were in my situation and wanted to start a breeding program what would you do?
Thanks for your time,
Quinn

[llovelace]

I'll let the experts answer your question.

[J.Vandegrift]

I wouldn't bother breeding rats until you had more than 10 or so snakes. To me, it is just not worth the hassle until you have a bunch of animals. The best advice I can think of is to buy the nicest pastels and the nicest bumblebee you can find. It is well worth spending a few hundred more now and produce amazing offspring in a couple years than to buy the cheapest snakes you can find and end up hatching out crap. Also if you have a little extra cash I would buy yearling pastel females instead of hatchlings. It will get you a year closer to breeding, and you will have a better idea of the quality of the pastels by the time they are yearlings. I would also pick up a few proven female normals. You can get them very cheap now and you could possibly produce bumblebees next spring.

If it were me I would get 2 yearling female pastels, 3 adult female normals, and the Bumblebee male.

[nova2door]

if i had the money i would find a nice female super pastel first, then add 2 or 3normals about 800g to 1,000g range, then get a nice bumble bee male.
you can always add more females (pastels, spiders, normals, ect.) as you get money.
i didn't have the money so i started with a pastel male last year and added 2 spider females this year.
i wouldn't breed rats until you have atleast 6 or 8 snakes. you work at a pet store so maybe you get a discount on rats anyway.
as pfan151 said buy nice looking snakes not cheap snakes

[Oxylepy]

This is the order I'd set things up:

Rack System First, if you want to breed and want something simple I would say get something to allow 1 40+q per level for each female you want (IMO go with how many you want +1 for another just in case) then 2 32q per level for however many males you want (again +1 level IMO) then you will want hatchling levels (should be able to fit 12q tubs 4/level and you will probably want at least 1~2 levels per breeding female you have). Either build it yourself or buy some racks (if you buy I would say get your female rack first, probably a 3 level, male/juvenile rack second, and then third your hatchling rack when you are about to breed). When you get this you will want a thermostat.
After you have your rack setup get all your temperatures figured out you will need a temp gun, a scale, some hemostats, hides, water bowls, substrate, and you may want a miniature freezer for storing rodents.
Then you should go out and get your females. You should figure breeding after at least 18 months of their life and 1500g or more. Get your males a bit before breeding (6 months or so) and then get them up to 500g or more.

Before actually breeding make sure you can build an incubator, you have your hatchling rack and you know what you are getting into. THEN you can breed.

Figure your first rack will be between 200 and 500 dollars building or buying, building would be cheapest but you will need the space to build it as well as air it out if you put any sealants on it. Then figure around 200 extra for the little things (scale, hemostats, hides, bowls, etc). After that you can start thinking about your snakes, which depends on the snakes you are getting for price.

And don't bother breeding rats, it actually costs you more than feeding frozen. You will need quite a few snakes and quite a lot of room before you should breed rats.

[ThyTempest]

I think overall, you have been given good advice, and I am (wish I am) in the same boat right now.

I am going to go against the grain and say that breeding feeders would be a good idea, but maybe not right off the bat. If the snakes you buy are already taking f/t, then just keep buying from a supplier. If some of them will take live rats, but not f/t, I would breed b/c the petstores rape you on feeders. Another bonus to breeding your own is you have ultimate control over feeder size, you would already have an established colony when you start getting hatchlings that may only feed on live for a while, and honestly, they are really fun, but that doesnt happen to everyone.

All in all, unless you have 10-15+ snakes, it is almost always cheaper to just buy frozen from a supplier, but the things that make it worth it for us (1 bp off feed, but would eat a small-medium rat a week, 2 boas eating small rats, and 2 corns on rat pinks/ASF hoppers, is that we dont have a car, so the convenience of having them right here is worth the time, money and effort needed to run errands such as getting feeders. If you have the freezer space, which we dont, you can always buy in bulk from an online dealer pretty cheap.

Next issue is what you want to breed. Rats and mice are still the standard, but African Soft Fur Rats are the up and coming feeder. They smell less than rats, waaaay less than mice, are prolific breeders, you dont have to worry about cycling a male, are supposedly good for problem/picky eaters, they are mean, so you probably wont get too attached to them and not want to feed them, and their adult size is perfect for bp's...about the size of a small-medium rat, but they take a long time to get there. Their growth rate is even slower than mice, and nothing like the super-growth of rats.

Good luck.

[gcanibe]

First got the females and 1 year later got the males...

[West Coast Jungle]

I would start by bringing up females. Pastels and spiders are great for combos and relatively inexpensive, I would start with them. Your girls are gonna need to be at least 2 years older then males so dont even bother with a boy at first. Build up your females and when they are 1000 grams get a male that excites you. They will be cheaper by then plus the more you learn about BP morphs the more you will change what your favorite is.

The most important thing is do your homework and be patient.

[Slim]

i came across all of the different ball python morphs, and wow those are nicer then most fish, and you can touch them

Nicer than most fish?

Welcome to BP.net.

Before you get too far down the breeding road, I would suggest you purchase a BP or maybe two, and see how you do with husbandry and feeding and such. Once that's going well, you can start thinking about setting up a breeding project.

When you say you don't like rodents, is that going to cause you a problem when you have to handle them (dead or alive) for feeding. Just something to think about.

[Darkice]

Start out slow. Get an unrelated pair of hatchlings and raise them. After a couple years when they get close to breeding size get a rack and incubator.
If your successful sell some hatchlings and buy a couple more adults. And maybe keep a couple of your hatchlings to increase your stock. After a couple more years get a few different morphs and try to make something nobody else has. What im making right now will rock the foundation of the ball python world.