Am I a bad person!

[ExoticsBySize]

I got a new ball about 2 weeks ago who seems to be very under weight for his size he is about 1 1/2-2 feet and slim (looks more like a cornsnake that a BP) anyway last week was his first feeding with me. To make a long story short I ended up with one dead mouse that another ball had constricted but didn't eat. So instead of me throwing the mouse away I tried feeding it to the new guy with a pair of thongs.He took the mouse but it had to be the worst strike in history.It was so bad that if the mouse was alive that he would have torn my BP to shreds.So instead of me feeding live today what I was going to do was switch him to F/T but the pet shop didn't have any today so i choose 2 mice and I was going to have them prekilled by the owner well she wasn't in today so what I choose to do was try it myself. Heres where I came up with the question am I bad person.What I did was right before I feed him was I took the mouse and placed the thongs around his neck and squeezed him to dead . I didn't see what the big deal was myself because its kinda the same thing the snake does .But my mom and lil brother where treating me lil I was Hitler Its not like I killed the mice for fun! I killed them myself because I though it was best for my snake! So my question is am I a bad person for this ?!

[ChicaPiton519]

my mom gets over it now, i feed the boa fresh killed large rats, i have to kill them myself, its not hard, but it is kinda worse, a fast slam to the back of the rats neck on the cement steps that go up to my pool deck and they are pretty much all nerves after that... aka dead... mom thinks im horable, but its the fastest thing i can think of... lol

[blackcrystal22]

Heres what I do to the mice I have bred into adults.
I take them by the tail.
Place a paper towel on a hard surface, WHACK WHACK it twice.

Its basically not conscious after that even if it is still alive.. I love all animals. Your not a bad person.. Your method is a bit.. odd though.

An easy way is to put one in a paper bag and hit the bag as hard as you can on the table a few times. :]

Its quick for the mouse, quicker than what the snake does. It's also a lot safer for the snakes.

[rabernet]

The only recognized humane way to pre-kill is by a CO2 chamber, and we have stickies in the feeder forum on how to make one.

I don't think that the method that you chose was humane, IMHO.

I have never pre-killed, all of my animals feed live, always have and I've never had an injury as a result of live feeding (and I've fed off over 4000 live prey items to snakes of all sizes).

I don't offer on tongs, I don't feed in a separate enclosure. I allow my animals to hunt from the safety of their hides, and they are swift and efficient hunters.

[xBrycex]

your not a bad person you just looking out for the health of you snake! i like to use one of those snake bags and spin it around a few times to disorientate the rat before i thump it. in the future just hit it hard against something... like "cement stairs" and good looking out for your snake!

[Mindibun]

It's good that you are looking out for your snake, but I agree with Rabernet that the method you chose was inhumane. The prey was most likely fully conscious while you strangled/squeezed it. That's a tremendous amount of pressure being put on the body, and a lot of fear and adrenaline running through the brain.

When a snake constricts a mouse, they do not strangle it at the throat. They wrap themselves around the entirety of its body, and are able to exert so much pressure on the prey that it stops blood flow. The loss of blood to the brain renders the prey unconscious while the snake finishes the kill.

That, to me, is a big difference. I hope that next time you'll choose another method of pre-killing. They say that CO2 is humane, but Carbon dioxide doesn't allow the animals to slowly drift off to sleep like Carbon Monoxide does. When using CO2, the animal is fully aware that it is suffocating. Please keep that in mind when using CO2 chambers. I completely understand the use of them, and I'm not telling anyone to NOT use one. But I do want everyone to know that it isn't an "easy, pain-and-stress-free" death like most think it is. Some people will also choose to snap the neck of the prey, thus dislocating the brain from the spinal column. But researchers have found that the brain still continues to function for a very short time once it is severed from the body. So neither decapitation nor wringing of the neck are all that humane either.

I suppose that xBrycex's method of disorienting the rat and then whacking it hard enough to render it unconscious on the first blow is the best or most humane method to pre-kill. Allowing the snake to kill the animal naturally is, in my opinion, far more desirable than pre-killing. But I do understand your situation.

The above info was just a little food for thought while we were on the subject.

[littleindiangirl]

but its the fastest thing i can think of... Lol

Wow... or you could just CO2. Boa's aren't picky about that much. Save you some energy and perhaps some guilt if you miss one of these times and render the poor thing in extreme amounts of pain.

It was so bad that if the mouse was alive that he would have torn my BP to shreds.

I understand that this was a rushed killing, but the struggle a live rat/mouse puts up is enough to get the snake to constrict to their full potential.

CO2 is by far the most humane method. I've watched it a dozen of times, and the rats just move around, fall asleep then pass away.

[blackcrystal22]

It's good that you are looking out for your snake, but I agree with Rabernet that the method you chose was inhumane. The prey was most likely fully conscious while you strangled/squeezed it. That's a tremendous amount of pressure being put on the body, and a lot of fear and adrenaline running through the brain.

When a snake constricts a mouse, they do not strangle it at the throat. They wrap themselves around the entirety of its body, and are able to exert so much pressure on the prey that it stops blood flow. The loss of blood to the brain renders the prey unconscious while the snake finishes the kill.

That, to me, is a big difference. I hope that next time you'll choose another method of pre-killing. They say that CO2 is humane, but Carbon dioxide doesn't allow the animals to slowly drift off to sleep like Carbon Monoxide does. When using CO2, the animal is fully aware that it is suffocating. Please keep that in mind when using CO2 chambers. I completely understand the use of them, and I'm not telling anyone to NOT use one. But I do want everyone to know that it isn't an "easy, pain-and-stress-free" death like most think it is. Some people will also choose to snap the neck of the prey, thus dislocating the brain from the spinal column. But researchers have found that the brain still continues to function for a very short time once it is severed from the body. So neither decapitation nor wringing of the neck are all that humane either.

I suppose that xBrycex's method of disorienting the rat and then whacking it hard enough to render it unconscious on the first blow is the best or most humane method to pre-kill. Allowing the snake to kill the animal naturally is, in my opinion, far more desirable than pre-killing. But I do understand your situation.

The above info was just a little food for thought while we were on the subject.

One of my friends snakes died from a rat bite.
I think if the snake will eat f/t or fresh killed that should be done instead.

The breeder I got my corn snake from told me to never feed live. He told me that one of his adult kingsnakes was killed instantly when the mouse bit the snake directly on the spinal cord.

I don't think its worth the risk. When people say that 'thats what they do in the wild' they don't take into consideration that this IS captivity, not the wild. Things will always need to be different in captivity. :]

[Bruce Whitehead]

As noted... when a snake kills its prey it is far more efficient that what you did.

You may love your snake, but if you are going to kill your own prey then you need to respect and honor the prey as well.

Snakes are efficient at what they do... what you did was not. Maybe that is not what you want to hear, but the reality is that you need to educate yourself regarding humanely euthanizing your feeders.

If you are feeding one animal to keep another alive then you need to respect both of them. Do not be glib about it, and pay homage to what that rat is "giving" you and your snake.

There is plenty of information available that addresses how you can do this humanely... read humanly... and it is your responsibility to take that seriously.

Bruce

[Bruce Whitehead]

The breeder I got my corn snake from told me to never feed live.

Live feeding must be done responsibly. Sadly too many people do not engage in this, and then all live feeders get a bad rap for it.

I feed close to 20 snakes live every week and have never had a mishap. Not to say it will never happen, but like any other aspect of animal keeping, people need to be attentive and engaged in what they are doing.

Bruce