Massive prolapse- again?!

[Arirang]

Hello, all,

A couple of weeks ago, I posted that Nagini had a prolapsed cloaca. Fairly minor- went back in by itself, vet put her under, took a look, stitched her up, prescribed some meds, said no food for two weeks. Great recovery, got her meds down her, everything went fine.

Well, now we're back there again... Only this time, it's so much bigger than before. I just started sobbing when I saw it because it looks so freaking bad. Like... Before it was maybe the diameter of my little fingertip and perhaps a quarter of an inch long. Now it's... This nickel-sized sphere of just... red. She seems to not even notice, she prowls around for food and just drags it all through her substrate like it's no big deal, which of course worries me even more but if I keep her in the critter keeper without substrate she'll just flip out and spend the night pressed against the plastic slats trying to escape.

I did finally notice for real, right before I saw her with the prolapse, a mild-to-moderate mite infestation in her bedding. I decided to change it out, then found her. I very carefully took her out, hiding place and all, and put her in a critter keeper while I changed the bedding to something different- Forest Floor to Aspen shavings. I put her back in, sprayed /very/ thoroughly, put her humidifier in and on high. I'm going to spray her again before bed.

Basically, two questions. 1) Were the mites the problem? They weren't excessive- it's not like the bedding was alive. They were just present and the only reason I noticed them was because I was looking for her and happened to see them move. It wasn't a bad infestation at all, I've seen worse with my hermit crabs before while they were alive (minor mite infestations are actually even beneficial to hermit crabs as they cannot hurt the crabs, but consume leftover food and the like from their carapaces).

2) Is she going to make it? I'm taking her to a different vet tomorrow morning, as mine is closed Saturday. I just need to know if she'll be okay. I'm keeping it moist, and I had no sugar (and indeed didn't trust myself touching something that red and bloated anyways) for a sugar wrap as my vet recommended if I saw it again. I just... can't lose her this young. I just lost my crabs to in-molt cannibalism and that was hard enough, but she is so young and gregarious and vibrant and I just cannot lose her this young. She's not even a year old yet.

[Bogertophis]

I wish I could tell you she's going to be OK, but that's asking a lot...you need a real vet, seeing the real snake. I sure hope so, it's so frustrating to have a snake
seem to recover only to have the problem recur... But if you're SEEING mites, it's a BAD infestation. I'd do as your previous vet suggested...the sugar trick...why
would you not? Anything to reduce her suffering & lessen the chance of more damage & infection...don't wimp out now, she needs YOUR help. AND the vet's!

BTW, there are multiple issues that can cause such prolapse, including constipation, diarrhea, parasites or even a birth defect. Cannot diagnose your snake here.

[Arirang]

I have no sugar and I do not recall his exact advice. I feel like such a failure as a pet parent right now...

[Bogertophis]

I have no sugar and I do not recall his exact advice. I feel like such a failure as a pet parent right now...

No mini-marts open all night there? or Walmart or grocery store?

Didn't you use KY jelly the last time to keep it moist? Do that...but first get rid of substrate, only use clean paper on floor, & rinse the
prolapsed tissue with sterile saline solution, then the KY jelly.

[Bogertophis]

You can also use mineral oil to keep it moist, if no KY jelly, until you get to vet a.s.a.p.

Actually the sugar & water (mixed to paste consistency & slathered on gently) is an option to try to shrink the tissues, and for
that hemorrhoid cream can also be tried, but it sounds like you're better off letting the vet push the tissues back in anyway. (?)

[Arirang]

I'm going to Walmart now. A bit of a drive but I'll do it for her. No "exotics" vets open today in driving distance see snakes (how they can call themselves exotics vets is beyond me). Is it safe for her to travel far? I can take her a few towns away but it's over an hour and she doesn't like the travel box. Would it be safer to wait for my vet to open on Monday? I don't know what to do.

Just to check, my shopping list should be:

Real sugar
KY jelly
Mineral oil

Anything else?

[zina10]

You need to remove the bedding, ALL bedding, asap.

Once you have her rinsed and treated she needs to go to a completely clean and sterile as possible enclosure. You don't have to put her into a substrate less critter keeper. Just take the substrate out of her regular enclosure and put paper towels in.

Aspen has a lot of dust and small pieces of wood. All of which will stick to the prolapse. If it retreats even a tiny little bit, it would pull all that dirt in with it.

Spraying the Aspen and putting the humidifier in won't help with that at all. High moisture and heat breeds bacteria. Esp. with substrate in there. Normally not a big deal unless you let it get filthy, but right now things aren't normal. Part of her intestine are on the outside of her body.

You can lightly spray the paper towel for keeping things moist. Clean is critically important right now.

Clean the prolapse carefully , apply the sugar paste, and put her up in her enclosure on paper towels. Then try to get the next available Vet appointment.

Good luck with your baby..

ps. you are not a failure. You got help the first time. You are here to get help with the repeat issue. I doubt that wood mite infested substrate caused the prolapse. Just make sure your temps and husbandry are 100% and keep it as sterile for now as you can.

[zina10]

And yes, if there is any chance that a reptile experienced vet could see her today, I would go!

Clean the area very carefully first, just to get any substrate that is stuck on it off, since you don't want her to damage the intestine while she moves about in her travel container.

Cover the travel container with a dark towel (leaving airflow) to minimize stress..

[Bogertophis]

...Is it safe for her to travel far? I can take her a few towns away but it's over an hour and she doesn't like the travel box.
Would it be safer to wait for my vet to open on Monday? ...

I'd take the first appointment with a herp-qualified vet, as others already said.
(It was late last night, I forgot that the mites you were talking about were "wood mites"...I assumed "snake mites" from your post...sorry.)

Shorter car rides are always preferable but sometimes a trip is unavoidable; either way, the BEST & SAFEST way to travel with your snake is to gently put them
in a cloth bag (or pillow case), use a wire twist-tie to close it, then double that part over itself & put a rubber band around that...snakes cannot open that. THEN,
put that bag w/ snake into an "ice chest" or styrofoam box* to keep the temperatures constant & protect the snake. If it's cold out, a bottle or jar of very warm
water (also in the box) will work to keep the snake warmer (if you don't have a heat pack). You can crumple some newspaper or use a towel under the bagged
snake for added cushion...remember your snake isn't wearing a seat belt & quick stops happen... (*small snakes fit into insulated lunch boxes too)

You aren't a failure as a snake parent, just feeling frustrated & overwhelmed with the recurring health issue that you thought was fixed...we've pretty much all
"been there", or if not, sooner or later we will be...it's part of keeping live creatures with or without legs.

[Bogertophis]

And no I don't think wood mites have ANYTHING to do with the prolapse, they're just an annoyance.)