What is going on?

[Melluns07]

Hello everyone,

I am going to list all of my info before getting started.

BP: Sex Unknown, 95 grams 16"

Enclosure: 10 gallon tank w/screen top 1/3 covered in foil. All sides other than front are covered in a wrap to reduce visibility.

Temps/Humidity: 78-80 degrees ambient air temp, 86-89 degree hot spot.

Husbandry: Log hide on hot side, artificial plant hide on cool side climbing branch on both sides.

Heating: 1 med UTH w/digital thermostat.

Thermometers: 4 total thermometers, 1 analog 3 digital and 1 digital hydrometer.

Problem: I got him on 07/06, he ate a 19 gram f/t mouse on 07/08 and he ate it no problem. He then started a shed the next day and finished on the 13th. He had quite the busy first week. It was a beautiful shed, I found it late so I could not unroll it but I know it was all there as I only had to remove about 1/4" of shed on his tail. As he is only 95 grams I have been offering food every 5 days. I know temps and humidity are right as his shed was good. Right after his shed I tried to feed him and he acted very interested, got right up to it, tongued it then backed away from it and stared at me, LITERALLY stared at me. Naturally I waited a few days and offered it again with the same results. Two days after that I offered him a mouse pinky...literally smaller than his head and he took it instantly. Also he has started to get VERY active at about 5:45-6:00pm. Where I am in Texas the sun is still up after 9:30pm right now so I thought this was kind of odd for him to be this active so early. Now it has evolved into full fledged chaos...he is somehow literally going all the way to the top of the tank and wedging himself in the corners...I mean completely off the ground, I have NO idea how he is doing it as there is nothing for him to grab on to..but he gets in such a way that if I even move the screen top he falls...not to mention he falls half the time he does it and I am concerned he is going to hurt himself. At first I thought he was hungry, he obviously is not, as of the last feeding I have offered him the following: FT mouse, FT Rat fuzzy, Live Rat Fuzzy, Live weaned mouse. He showed NO interest in any of them. I am really worried something is wrong with him. I had him at the vet on the 13th for a routine visit and the vet said he looked fine. I am considering moving him over to a tub thinking maybe now he is not shedding or digesting he is actually looking at his home and is not pleased with it. What does everyone here think ? Since his fast he is down 2 grams to 93 grams. It has been 3 weeks since he has eaten a REAL meal and has been 1 1/2 weeks since he ate the pinky. I posted this in husbandry and the replies said they think this is hunger signs. Problem is he still has not eaten. I also notice while he is moving around his breathing is very fast and hard. He does not have a RI, I check for that almost daily as I have to fight to lower the humidity where I am. That leads me to believe he is stressed out and not feeling secure enough which is causing him to fast. There is no traffic in the room he is in until I get home and it is only myself in there sitting at a chair (he is in my gaming office) What should I do ? I know at his size he cannot go that long without food and I am starting to consider assisted feeding as he is not an established feeder yet. Also to make matters worse I got him from Petsmart...I know I know but believe it or not they had the best deal on him and I am being told they only feed their snakes pinkies. The mouse I got him to eat on night 2 was an Arctic Mice Brand "large mouse" it was 19 grams. Is this normal behavior ? I know he is moving around trying to get out because at one point I turned around and what do you know...his head was coming out of the corner where my wires come out of and he was just chilling there. Would moving him over to a tub do more harm that good at this point ? Should I just see this phase through (if this is normal) or do I need to correct something ?

[Regius_049]

First, I should note that while it is certainly not ideal for a young snake to go more than a week without eating, they undoubtedly can. While they cannot go as long as adults, ball pythons are quite robust and can go awhile without ill effect. A 2g loss on a 95g snake is still only around 1-2%, not major. Your snake is unlikely to be getting close to death's door.

Now, to the issue at hand -

(1) Moving him to a tub may indeed be a prudent choice. The tubs are more opaque and for very young snakes like yours, they appear to offer more security than a glass enclosure. As your snake grows, he/she will very likely become less finicky and an easier eater in my experience. As an anecdote (which I believe I posted elsewhere before), I once moved a ~6 month old kingsnake from a tub to a large glass exo-terra (36" x 18") and observed (in my opinion) negative results. While he did eat, he was defensive and hissed quite often. In the tub, he was mellow both before the move and after I moved him back into the tub. As snakes grow up, their behavior appears to be less enclosure dependent.

As a semi-side note, for all my ball pythons, they were all raised from hatchling size (~100g) in 30 QT tubs until they outgrow medium hide boxes (this is usually as they approach 800-1000g). I then move them to 48" x 24 x 14" enclosures for their final stay. I use the slightly larger tubs so I have to buy fewer tubs, move the snakes less, and it stays a relatively cheap endeavor.

(2) In regards to your "enclosure climbing" behavior. I have a black-tailed cribo that did the exact same thing when he was younger. I can report it had no observable ill effect on the snake from falling or getting stuck. It is possible it was born from a desire for more security via "hiding" and it allowed him to be in a small "crack" that he could feel on all sides. There is a term for it that I have forgotten, but generally speaking, snakes seem to prefer tighter fitting hides. In short, it is possible you have nothing to be concerned about, but you might look at his hide and consider if you could perhaps give him one that would be a "better" or "tighter" fit.

(3) Concerning feeding, I will give you the advice that has worked for me in the past and the advice I usually give new owners with young ball pythons. Warm/thaw out a mouse/rat of appropriate size and place it inside his warm hide and give him maybe 12-24 hours. Often times the snake will take it on the first attempt, but rarely you may have to try a few times. I have a female ball python that, to this day, still feeds via this method.

[Melluns07]

This was AMAZING !

Thank you so much, can you tell I am one worrisome pet owner ? LOL.

I am going to go ahead and try to move him today, I got him a little smaller of a hide to use in there, his current log hide is just a tad too large although when he is inside his body touches both sides of it. I got him a new smaller hide to use as a humid hide on the cool side.

I just wanted to make sure I wasnt stressing him to the point that is is detrimental to his health. Thanks for also clarifying his eating. I have always read to offer them food every 5-7 days as babies but have never been told how long babies can go without food. So thank you for that.