Questions About Producing Black Axanthic Offspring

[Aedryan Methyus]

Hello Fellow Snake Lovers! This is my first post and i'm happy to have found this great community!

I stopped keeping snakes a few years ago, but I can no longer resist the urge to get back into it. I am preparing to get into breeding this time around as well. Though, breeding is relatively new to me, i'm learning all I possibly can and still trying to wrap my mind around the genetic aspects of it all. So, please forgive my ignorance. Right now, I am still in the planning and preparation stages of everything and I will soon be looking to pick up a pair of something cool as soon as I decide what the most feasible route will be for me to get started...

With regards to producing Black Axanthic offspring, would that require a male and female that are both het for Black Axanthic? What if I were to put a 66% het for Black Axanthic with say, a Normal? Would it still be possible to produce Black Axanthic offspring?

Any advice you guys could give me would be greatly appreciated. No matter what, I keep coming back to the Black Axanthics. They are definitely going to be where I will ultimately be putting most of my efforts. But, judging by the prices i'm seeing it seems that is going to have to be a long term project, unfortunately...

~ Aedryan

[piedlover79]

Black Axanthic is recessive so you need two copies of the gene. You can not produce them using a normal in a single generation. You would have to breed the offspring of a normal x 66% het back to one another and there would be no telling if you even had the gene since the 66% het is also 33% chance of just being a normal as well. If he was het all the babies would only have a 50% shot of being het.

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[Stewart_Reptiles]

With regards to producing Black Axanthic offspring, would that require a male and female that are both het for Black Axanthic?

Yes

What if I were to put a 66% het for Black Axanthic with say, a Normal? Would it still be possible to produce Black Axanthic offspring?

No you would produce either all normal or 50/50 (Normal & Het Black Axanthic), that would depend if whether or not the Possible Black Axanthic is indeed a het or just a normal.

In the event the animal turns out to be het black axanthic all the offspring would be normal looking and be considered 50% Het Black Axanthic. (no way to tell which are normal which are hets)

You are looking at YEARS of work and raising up animals and the eventuality that the 66% Het Black Axanthic is just a normal.

[PokeyTheNinja]

With regards to producing Black Axanthic offspring, would that require a male and female that are both het for Black Axanthic? What if I were to put a 66% het for Black Axanthic with say, a Normal? Would it still be possible to produce Black Axanthic offspring?

~ Aedryan

Both female and male must carry the heterozygous gene because it is not a dominant, it is a recessive. Normals (wild types) do not possess any form of heterozygous gene (not talking about dinkers or rare cases) unless bred from a pairing that contains said gene. Even with just pairing two hets together and not a visual, you're still taking a gamble on whether you do get a visual recessive or not, though you still have a chance on getting one. I suggest using the morph calculator on worldofballpythons.com It gives you possibility percentages of what you can produce in a clutch. However, you cannot be specific on what percentage of Het you obtained. Best of luck, some pretty awesome Axanthic morph combos out there and it's even beautiful on it's own.

[Aedryan Methyus]

Thanks so much for all of your replies! It looks like I found my home on the internet for sssnake dissscusssionsss! But, yes... I pretty much figured the male and female would both have to be het for BA and that a project like this would most likely take years breeding offspring to come to fruition... *sigh* In the meantime, I would be happy with producing other Black Pastel Axanthic dark varieties. So, do you guys think a reasonable starting point for me might be to pickup a pair of 66% het for BA babies to start growing up then once the male is old enough to breed, I could put him with (whatever cool snake) for another year or two while i'm waiting for the female BA to grow up? Perhaps a Black Pewter Het Clown or something?

Super Black Pastels are of huge interest to me as well, but I am aware of the potential duck billing/kink with them. I must have pretty good taste, because it seems that everything that interests me most is either going to be very costly, problematic or take years to come to fruition or all of the above...lol

[piedlover79]

I would not gamble on two 66% hets, you turn your chance of success way down when you are dealing with two unknonws. By they time you figure out if both snakes have the gene and if they do also get lucky enough that they produce (only a 25% chance of that even if they are both het) by that time the price will have come down due to people just outright breeding Black Ax to Black Ax. Throw another gene into your mix of 66% hets and you might have to produce *hundreds* of snakes before you get what you want assuming you ever do since you're not starting out 100% sure that you're even working with the gene.

[piedlover79]

PS- welcome to the forum.

Also if you like all black snakes look into doing Super Suma...although another spendy project.

[cletus]

Welcome to the forum!

[Aedryan Methyus]

Thank you for the welcomes, guys! I look forward to spending lots of time here!

Also if you like all black snakes look into doing Super Suma...although another spendy project.

Wow... Those are gorgeous, too! They seem to be pretty rare. I definitely don't foresee ever spending $10,000.00 on a snake, either... lol What are they cross-breeding to get the Super Suma's?

[yardy]

Thank you for the welcomes, guys! I look forward to spending lots of time here!



Wow... Those are gorgeous, too! They seem to be pretty rare. I definitely don't foresee ever spending $10,000.00 on a snake, either... lol What are they cross-breeding to get the Super Suma's?

Suma is SUper MAhogany. All that you need is a pair of mahoganies, some patience and a bit of luck. Single gene mahogany makes for some nice combos anyway.