Substrate question (and let's throw in one about lights, too)

[Moosefriend]

As much as I've read the past while, I still would like to double check! I want to give my baby a good home and life, after all.

Substrate

My friend got aspen and it was infested with mites, so today I took the cypress mulch I bought and baked it just in case. My question is, can I (or should I) mix it with anything? Soil, sand...? It just seems like it would be hard to dig in. It's the ZooMed "forest floor". Their chart says it's good for burrowing but it just seems... chunky.

Yes, I realize papers are way easier to maintain, but I like the look (and smell!!) of the cypress~

As for lighting

Pretend that I can keep good humidity and heat in my tank. Does anyone recommend a CHE over a (red) bulb, or vice versa, and give me some reasons? The lightless part of a CHE is appealing to me, but I hear they get SUPER SCARY hot?? The lamp dome I have has a built in dimmer (All Living Things), so I was wondering if that would help.

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I've had two pet store employees (who own bps) tell me NOT to use heat pads. And one said he heats the tank with a regular old house lightbulb (and turns it off at night). The second especially is making me... nervous? So I just want some... back up, on info, since what he's recommending is contradicting some things I've read. I'm also wondering what his night time temps are if there's no heat at all... He says "it gets cold in the desert after all".

I would be using a heat pad but can't find a thermostat that isn't 100-200$... I'll be getting one later for sure, though. Canada sucks, my area especially.

Thanks for reading!

[chrid16371]

There is Canada distributors of spyder robotic Herpstat thermostat, you just have to order online.

Che is way better than a red bulb, they heat similar to a rhp which in my opinion is the best heating device. The che will help with humidity issues. Just make sure your snake cant come in direct contact with it, same with a red bulb. You do need to control the heat and a thermostat is the best choice but your dimmer dome would work in the mean time, you will just have to make sure you monitor your temps closely with a temp gun or digital thermometer with probe placed under the middle of che on the ground to make sure temps is 88-90, you would do the same with a red bulb. The reason you have to monitor more closely when using a dimmer is bc if the room temperature changes you will have to dim it more or less bc it won't automatically adjust like a thermostat will, you have to do this whether your using a red bulb, che, uth, or any heat device. If your going to buy a che then you should buy the highest watt you can find and dim it where you need it to be, better to have to much and dim then to little and can't do anything. Like I said make sure you use a digital thermometer with probe like an acurite 00891 or a temp gun, the analog thermometers are cheap and not accurate.

Unfortunately I don't have advice on the substrate bc I don't use it.

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[Soord]

My pythons hate the red bulb and never come out of the hide with it on. I have both a UTH and a che because my houses gets super cold in the winter and that worked fine. Also order it on amazon? This one will work until you get more money for a herpstat. and heating your cage with a regular lightbuls is ridiculous and probably stresses the snake out a ton. I highly recommend a UTH and thermo over any type of light

http://www.amazon.com/MTPRTC-ETL-Cer...mostat+reptile

[Freakie_frog]

As much as I've read the past while, I still would like to double check! I want to give my baby a good home and life, after all.

Substrate

My friend got aspen and it was infested with mites, so today I took the cypress mulch I bought and baked it just in case. My question is, can I (or should I) mix it with anything? Soil, sand...? It just seems like it would be hard to dig in. It's the ZooMed "forest floor". Their chart says it's good for burrowing but it just seems... chunky.

Yes, I realize papers are way easier to maintain, but I like the look (and smell!!) of the cypress~

No don't mix it with anything. Use it as it comes

As for lighting

Pretend that I can keep good humidity and heat in my tank. Does anyone recommend a CHE over a (red) bulb, or vice versa, and give me some reasons? The lightless part of a CHE is appealing to me, but I hear they get SUPER SCARY hot?? The lamp dome I have has a built in dimmer (All Living Things), so I was wondering if that would help.

-----------------

I've had two pet store employees (who own bps) tell me NOT to use heat pads. And one said he heats the tank with a regular old house lightbulb (and turns it off at night). The second especially is making me... nervous? So I just want some... back up, on info, since what he's recommending is contradicting some things I've read. I'm also wondering what his night time temps are if there's no heat at all... He says "it gets cold in the desert after all".

I would be using a heat pad but can't find a thermostat that isn't 100-200$... I'll be getting one later for sure, though. Canada sucks, my area especially.

Thanks for reading!

You can use either or both. In the past I used an UTH during the day and a 75w red that cam on at night. I used the UTH on a proportional thermostat the light on a timer. I used the eco earth too keep the humidity where it should be.

[Soord]

As for substrate i wouldn't put extra stuff in. Sometimes the dirt and sand can get in mouth or between scales and cause problems. I use plain aspen and nothing else for bedding and it works fine for my needs. It doesnt keep humidity as well but if you mist when it is low it works fine and has easy clean up and looks better than paper imo

[JodanOrNoDan]

I can't comment on the substrate. I only use paper. It is ugly but clean.
I don't use tanks, I use tubs.
Lights and heat emitters cause problems that I do not need.

Those statements can be helpful if you understand what I am telling you.

The most direct help I can be is I would not be listening to pet shop employees unless they work at a very reputable reptile specialty shop. The combined knowledge on this forum regarding ball pythons is very high and is far beyond anything I have found in any pet store, even those that specialize in reptiles.

[Moosefriend]

Thanks guys!
Okay, I can return the bulb for a CHE next time I go; I haven't used the red bulb yet. Do not mix substate. Save for that Herpstat - maybe even get a cheap on-off, use the dimmer and always check with the heat gun. *note to self, but it more batteries! The battery low message keeps coming up...*


@Chris, I've done A LOT of looking, and ordering from Canada and shipping to where I live (which isn't somewhere in the middle of no where!) is more expensive than shipping from Spyder themselves or Bean Farm (cheapest). Sadly, all options are near 200$ and I can't afford that right now.



@Soord, that unit at checkout is about 60$. I was hoping I would just save for a Herpstat Intro+, or a Hertpstat 2 if I should run the lamp+UTH. I have a digital temp/humidity probe and a digital - on - the - glass temp reader and a heat gun. The tank will be in an area I'm in 80% of the time, so there will be plenty of time to check it! I didn't think BPs could see the infrared light, though? How do we/you/they know they 'hate it'? I got red so I could keep it on all night. White light is stressful, and probably would not help me sleep I was wondering if a 'moonlight' would even be better than a red.


@Frankie_Frog, okay, I won't mix the substrate. I was just wondering since it feels chunky if it would be hard for them. Maybe I'm just a worry wart lol. I plan on doing the UTH/Lamp set up in the future. How long is the red lamp on at night? Are you saying that at night the UTH turned off and the lamp came on, or both were on at night?


@Soord, again, I'm afraid of the aspen my store carries now since my friend's was infested with mites... I also like the smell of mulch, hehe. I was worried about the soil/stuff getting caught in the eyes or heat pits, so that's why I asked. I just wanted to see if I could have a natural substrate that's less.. chunky, ad a bit more natural.


@Jordan, I'm keeping the BP as a pet, so I'd like him to have a nicer display than a translucent, plain papered tub that I can't enjoy watching him in. Yes, it would be the most cost effective and easily maintained, but I'd like to be able to peek over and see him doing his noodly stuff, than a foggy white bin. I understand their uses and pros, especially for breeders. But as a pet owner, I guess I'm going more for a... 'vivarium'?


What problems to heat and light emitters cause you? Humidity? I will be getting a UTH when I can afford a Herpstat, but 200+ is quite a lot for a unit that's 99$.


I'm not listening to the pet store employees; I mostly mentioned them because what they say contradicts the thousands of experienced keepers and breeders here, almost to a funny extent! I don't usually listen to them when they speak to me. Smile and nod, and read all you can weeks ahead of time. Though, I'd feel bad if someone said that to me and I worked in a pet store, because I love my animals and want to give them good care beyond "Oh yeah just get the plastic tiny hamster cage from All Living Things and all these tubes and attachments he can suffocate in. It's just a hamster, buy another".


I was talking to a breeder who used to work at one of the pet stores, who moved to a more specialized one, and when I told him he got upset and was tempted to go in and give them a big lecture! Some are passionate, some are there because "Animals!!!!" and a paycheck. Heck, I'd say most are there because "Animals!!!!",but that's a discussion for another time

[Freakie_frog]

UTH can have a hard time keeping the temps right at night in a glass tank. I would keep the light on from sundown to sun raise. The light was more to offer the UTH some backup. With the proportional thermostat runs the UTH 24/7.

[chrid16371]

UTH can have a hard time keeping the temps right at night in a glass tank. I would keep the light on from sundown to sun raise. The light was more to offer the UTH some backup. With the proportional thermostat runs the UTH 24/7.

I 100% agree with this, I had problems keeping my cool side to temp with only a uth and that was in a PVC cage. I switched to rhps. A che will help heat your cool side as well as giving you your hot spot or you can run a uth with a che or bulb like said above.

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[Soord]

Thanks guys!
Okay, I can return the bulb for a CHE next time I go; I haven't used the red bulb yet. Do not mix substate. Save for that Herpstat - maybe even get a cheap on-off, use the dimmer and always check with the heat gun. *note to self, but it more batteries! The battery low message keeps coming up...*


@Chris, I've done A LOT of looking, and ordering from Canada and shipping to where I live (which isn't somewhere in the middle of no where!) is more expensive than shipping from Spyder themselves or Bean Farm (cheapest). Sadly, all options are near 200$ and I can't afford that right now.



@Soord, that unit at checkout is about 60$. I was hoping I would just save for a Herpstat Intro+, or a Hertpstat 2 if I should run the lamp+UTH. I have a digital temp/humidity probe and a digital - on - the - glass temp reader and a heat gun. The tank will be in an area I'm in 80% of the time, so there will be plenty of time to check it! I didn't think BPs could see the infrared light, though? How do we/you/they know they 'hate it'? I got red so I could keep it on all night. White light is stressful, and probably would not help me sleep I was wondering if a 'moonlight' would even be better than a red.


@Frankie_Frog, okay, I won't mix the substrate. I was just wondering since it feels chunky if it would be hard for them. Maybe I'm just a worry wart lol. I plan on doing the UTH/Lamp set up in the future. How long is the red lamp on at night? Are you saying that at night the UTH turned off and the lamp came on, or both were on at night?


@Soord, again, I'm afraid of the aspen my store carries now since my friend's was infested with mites... I also like the smell of mulch, hehe. I was worried about the soil/stuff getting caught in the eyes or heat pits, so that's why I asked. I just wanted to see if I could have a natural substrate that's less.. chunky, ad a bit more natural.


@Jordan, I'm keeping the BP as a pet, so I'd like him to have a nicer display than a translucent, plain papered tub that I can't enjoy watching him in. Yes, it would be the most cost effective and easily maintained, but I'd like to be able to peek over and see him doing his noodly stuff, than a foggy white bin. I understand their uses and pros, especially for breeders. But as a pet owner, I guess I'm going more for a... 'vivarium'?


What problems to heat and light emitters cause you? Humidity? I will be getting a UTH when I can afford a Herpstat, but 200+ is quite a lot for a unit that's 99$.


I'm not listening to the pet store employees; I mostly mentioned them because what they say contradicts the thousands of experienced keepers and breeders here, almost to a funny extent! I don't usually listen to them when they speak to me. Smile and nod, and read all you can weeks ahead of time. Though, I'd feel bad if someone said that to me and I worked in a pet store, because I love my animals and want to give them good care beyond "Oh yeah just get the plastic tiny hamster cage from All Living Things and all these tubes and attachments he can suffocate in. It's just a hamster, buy another".


I was talking to a breeder who used to work at one of the pet stores, who moved to a more specialized one, and when I told him he got upset and was tempted to go in and give them a big lecture! Some are passionate, some are there because "Animals!!!!" and a paycheck. Heck, I'd say most are there because "Animals!!!!",but that's a discussion for another time

I mean they weren't active ever with the infrared. And my boy is a very active snake exploring all night around his cage and I left it on for about two weeks and used his che for my baby girl until I got her a uth. As soon as I switched back he was fine roaming the cage. The temps were similar and humidity was slightly more dry so my conclusion was he either didn't like it or something was going on. They both were fine with purple light though and both even better with a che. I currently use uth for all and a che on one to go with that and all seem happy.


Ahh I forget that Amazon does sales tax other places and last time I went to Canada it was like 15% or something. I also have prime so that may be a thing. The link I sent you says $26.50 USD for me which is like 35$ CAN. I guess it wouldn't be too bad as long as you have a dimmer and monitor it a lot but I'm all for a lazier approach haha.

And that pet store sounds terrible. In us if you gave someone mites you could prooobably get sued if it cost them a lot of trouble/money. And even if your bedding didn't have mites be wary and keep a look out if there was mites in the store they could be hiding in yours too.

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