Dreamsicle prodution--WWYD?

[dkspftw]

As a few people on here might know, I'm a BP noob who decided to go straight for the big leagues, and the first BP I purchased was a pied 100% het lavender albino female.

I'm starting to organize my apartment and finances to pick up her mate in the next 6 mo-1 yr or so, and I'd like to plan.

Not sure if this should be under breeding instead, as I have morph price questions, but of course mods feel free to move.

1. How much you guys think dreamsicles go for these days? If I make back the money I initially invest I'll be more than pleasantly surprised. I'm not doing this to make money so much as to produce the coolest snakes possible, but I need to gauge pricing/potential market softness in figuring out how much to pay for the male.

2. What genetic makeup should I go for? This relates back to question 1 in that overall pricing may determine what I decide to pick up.

As I understand it, if I got an actual dreamsicle male, my whole clutch is guaranteed to be either dreams or full het for the relevant genetics. Of course, that is the most expensive option. I believe I could also pick up a male with the same traits as my female, which would be a lower chance at dreamsicle production (and--am I wrong--wouldn't produce all 100% hets?) or possibly a non-pied het lavender albino male, which would be presumably the cheapest and least productive option.

WWYD? I figure my female is probably a bit over a year away from breeding, so I figure if I get a very young male soon-ish they should be ready around the same time.

(or, optional question #3, should I just go for an adult male when my female is ready? Is there much advantage to that, proven breeder-ness aside? I like the idea of raising my own normally but business is business.)

Sorry if this is a bit scattered.

And yes, I know it's ridiculous for a noob like me to be working with snakes this expensive but if there is one thing I am, it's ridiculous.

[BHReptiles]

If you can afford it, get a dreamsicle male. If you can't, think about getting a lavender albino het pied. At least ALL your babies will be double hets if not visuals.

The problem I see you running into is that if you are brand new, you may have trouble selling dreamsicles (a high-dollar morph) with no reputation. Just something to keep in the back of your mind.

[4theSNAKElady]

Hmmm....this is tough question to answer...directly. im guessing it depends on two things: how quickly you want a ROI, and how your finances are. If your finances are goood, and you can afford it, get the dream hatchling male in a year. That way, theyll both be ready at the same time, and the clutch should pay for your original investment....much quicker. Im sure adult vs baby is not going to differ terribly in price.

sent from my incubator

[4theSNAKElady]

Ps...i wish i had the kinda cash you do! :p

sent from my incubator

[Meltdown Morphs]

How does a person have trouble selling a dreamsicle because of reputation? its not like there's any guess work with its genetics to actually question, and its not a morph based on quality like a pastel. Why should reputation affect a obviously popular and difficult double recessive?

[BHReptiles]

How does a person have trouble selling a dreamsicle because of reputation? its not like there's any guess work with its genetics to actually question, and its not a morph based on quality like a pastel. Why should reputation affect a obviously popular and difficult double recessive?

it has nothing to do with the genetics of the animals. For me, I like to buy from people with a reputation or someone who's pretty active here on the forums. I want to be able to trust the buyer. If a buyer comes out selling something high-end and they don't have a single good guy thread on fauna or no one has heard of them, then it puts red flags up for me (as a buyer). That person may be legit and really did produce those animals, but it could read as a scam to some other buyers. I've seen it happen here on the forums!

I'm just offering up a warning that it's something to keep in mind because if this person is really new to the scene and doesn't have any good feed back, that could be a deterrent for a buying looking to buy the dreamsicle babies.

I'm not passing judgment on the OP or telling him not to do the breeding, I'm just giving him a slightly different perspective to keep in mind.

[dkspftw]

If you can afford it, get a dreamsicle male. If you can't, think about getting a lavender albino het pied. At least ALL your babies will be double hets if not visuals.

The problem I see you running into is that if you are brand new, you may have trouble selling dreamsicles (a high-dollar morph) with no reputation. Just something to keep in the back of your mind.

Hmmm....this is tough question to answer...directly. im guessing it depends on two things: how quickly you want a ROI, and how your finances are. If your finances are goood, and you can afford it, get the dream hatchling male in a year. That way, theyll both be ready at the same time, and the clutch should pay for your original investment....much quicker. Im sure adult vs baby is not going to differ terribly in price.

sent from my incubator

it has nothing to do with the genetics of the animals. For me, I like to buy from people with a reputation or someone who's pretty active here on the forums. I want to be able to trust the buyer. If a buyer comes out selling something high-end and they don't have a single good guy thread on fauna or no one has heard of them, then it puts red flags up for me (as a buyer). That person may be legit and really did produce those animals, but it could read as a scam to some other buyers. I've seen it happen here on the forums!

I'm just offering up a warning that it's something to keep in mind because if this person is really new to the scene and doesn't have any good feed back, that could be a deterrent for a buying looking to buy the dreamsicle babies.

I'm not passing judgment on the OP or telling him not to do the breeding, I'm just giving him a slightly different perspective to keep in mind.

Thanks guys, and I do appreciate the concern.

FWIW, I'm getting my stock from RDR and I've been in very active communication with the man himself (email trail, purchase receipts, etc.), so I'm confident he'll back me up on the genetics if there are any questions. And I figure if nothing else, my admittedly limited presence asking questions like this on BPnet will help people realize that I'm just a dude tryna breed some cool snakes.

Also, I post a lot about my pets on other forums, especially MFK (monsterfishkeepers.com) and I'm sure I could pull out a lot of legit references from people (and moderators) there, so I think I'll probably be OK. I hope! I suppose it also doesn't hurt that my herp vet is the curator of a zoo, so I could probably get him to send an email on my behalf if somebody was concerned. (He says my snakes look nicer than his!)

And lastly, to reiterate, what do you guys think a male dreamsicle goes for these days? Prediction for a year or so from now? (I've searched for them on KS but usually I just see geckos.)

[dkspftw]

Ps...i wish i had the kinda cash you do! :p

sent from my incubator

Meant to edit this into last post but was too late.

I founded a (non pet-related) business a couple of years ago and we do fairly well. I actually don't pay myself very much, so this represents pretty much all of my disposable income that isn't going to food/booze for the next 2 years or so.

Maybe it'll help with the above mentioned trust issues if potential buyers get an email with a fancy sig saying I'm a CFO? I'm terrible at math so I'm probably the world's worst, haha.

[CapeFearConstrictors]

I saw a female dream at Tinley and they were asking $10k for it. Males might be twice that? Be sure to shop around though, Ralph isn't the only breeder in the dream project.

[Pythonfriend]

this thread may be helpful since its about strategies to produce visual double recessives:

http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...ssive-projects

i wrote a lot there, and others also did, and it was just a few days ago, so, no reason to repeat everything. the usefulness of different pairings and different genetics and how to move forward, its pretty much all covered there. well, except for the market and pricing questions.