Pls help with my ball.

[Chiz]

I got a male lesser ball phyton. He is 840grams. I try to mate him. On january 30. But he didnt lock at all so i stop. On febuary 30And now my problem is he go off feed. He last ate on febuary 11. After that he did not eat at all. Up to now. And he is loosing weight. I weight him last night he is 712g. And he's spinal bone is showing. I am currently letting him to rest all alone no disturbance and try to feed him again after 2-3days.. Is it ok? Pls help me. I know ball python is off feeding. But i know they shouldn't lossing weight that fast.. Pls pls pls. Help me. TIA..

[nachash]

Everyone is going to tell you to go to the vet. If its rapidly losing weight and looks emaciated then something is wrong and only a good herp vet can actually tell you what is going on and what needs to be done. And if it doesn't want to eat give it more than 3 days between feeding attempts. If you're worried that a full week may be too long to wait then the snake is likely extremely ill.
When you say you are letting him now stay alone, what was his living conditions before? Was he not alone and not mostly free from disturbance? Healthy pythons are supposed to be alone and mostly free from disturbance to keep them healthy. When those minimums aren't met problems arise.
I am sure others will bring up temp and humidity. How are those?

[Chiz]

Everyone is going to tell you to go to the vet. If its rapidly losing weight and looks emaciated then something is wrong and only a good herp vet can actually tell you what is going on and what needs to be done. And if it doesn't want to eat give it more than 3 days between feeding attempts. If you're worried that a full week may be too long to wait then the snake is likely extremely ill.
When you say you are letting him now stay alone, what was his living conditions before? Was he not alone and not mostly free from disturbance? Healthy pythons are supposed to be alone and mostly free from disturbance to keep them healthy. When those minimums aren't met problems arise.
I am sure others will bring up temp and humidity. How are those?

Thanks for the fast reply nachash. Yup he is not alone. He is with a female.on a past few months. Actually my uncle borrow him to me. To mate to his female mojave.and i just cant say no to him.so i let him. And when i pick up my lesser on his home yesterday i was shock on my lesser that he losses weight that much.my uncle also own alot off ball python so i trusted him that he can take care of my lesser. I hope i didnt make a big mistake..my uncle is feeding he's snake alive. And mine is pre killed rat.and he likes to look on his snake everyday. And my treatment is only when cleaning the tub. Does it make difference? I am hopping its the way we treat our snake that is why my lesser is off feed on him. I am giving my lesser 3days to adopt again in his old tub here at my place. If he does not eat. Ill take him to the vet.. I cant loose him. My lesser is the first ball python.

Can he still survive a week? TIA

[KMG]

It would do us alot of good if you proof read your statement before posting. It's not very clear what you have going on.

The second post shared alot of info that you skipped in the first. If you have not had the snake how do you know a lock was not made?

Taking a shot in the dark here but it sounds like your uncle was trying to hard to breed him. I would not allow your uncle to borrow any more snakes if this is what happens. Learn to say no. I think it was over worked.

You confused me on the fact if the snake is now alone or not. If it is not I hope this is not because you have them living together
permanently. If something is wrong health wise then you could have potentially infected the female.

Checking your snakes is not going to cause this issue. I check mine several times a day. Trying to feed him to often when refusing can cause stress and add to the problem. I would wait a week to offer food again but if the snake is really as bad as you say i believe a vet visit is in order.

Have you or your uncle ever bred any snakes before?

[Chiz]

I am sorry KMG. And many thanks.I try to make it clear.

My lesser is eating regularly. I am giving him a pre killed rats every ten days to maintain his weight. Full shed always. Before my uncle borrowed it from me.

Now my uncle borrow my lesser pick it up here at my place and take it to his house. To mate on his female mojave.

Now weeks gone by. He told me that my lesser is gone off feed. I am not worry at that time coz i now ball python off feed when trying to mate right?.

After 2 weeks on his care. He told me that my lesser ate. So its ok. I know my lesser is in good condition..but that is the last meal of my lesser and he really gone to off feed. Still not worry because i think it is normal

After 6weeks on my lesser last meal. My uncle called me. And told me that i can get now my lesser. Because my lesser would not make a lock. On his female mojave.

So i go to his house yesterday. Then i am shocked on what happened. I saw my lesser like he is too thin and less energetic. And his spinal bone is showing off. That is the time i am so worried on what happen.

I immediately get my lesser. And drove to my house. Weight him. And put him to his tub.

Now i am waiting for 3 days starting today. To offer a food in my lesser.

- question : should i wait for 3-5 days to offer food? Or should i wait for him to shed first?

Lesser condition.
- loose skin
- when i hold him last night he still flicker his tongue
-no slimy or watery substance on the mouth. Indicating RI
- no mites.
- less active but still moving on my arm.while flickering gis tongue
- spinal bone showing off

HOW I TREAT MY SNAKES
- i have a snake room.
- closed and properly heated in right temperature. With windows so natural light comes in.

- handling
- i very occasionally handle my snake. Only when cleaning and checking for the condition.

- feeding
- pre killed rats. And sometimes they dont grab it. I will put the dead rat on there tub. And they will eat it slowly.

- humidity
- i keep a proper humidity and always have water in there tub

My uncle snake treatment
- also have a snake room
- with also have proper natural light.

- handling
- he likes to take picture. Hold it. Not everyday thou.

- feeding
- he feed live rats

-humidity
- same like mine.

My snake doesnt have any companion in there tub. They have individual tub.

- so my lesser. It is his first time to be introduce in a female. And another snake in his tub.

Breeding status

Me
-nope. I dont have any experience how to breed snakes. I am waiting for all my female ti mature next year. But all my equipment for breeding is already set up. Thanks to this forum.

My uncle
- same as me. Doesnt have any experience yet. But this is his season he got female ready to breed. He already have a female normal that is now building for ovulation. It is breed to his male bee.

Now should i be worry or is it just normal for my lesser to go off feed..

Thak you guys. Your help is much appreciated.

[nachash]

Okay, before I pass out....

If your uncle feeds live and your snakes typically get f/ t you have a fantastic way right there to traumatize the snake. That much weight loss could be a variety of things. Because you gave your snake to someone with a bunch of snakesnthat don't get cared for in the ideal sense a likely cause is an infection, and tons of strains are possible candidates. Also I am going to go out on a limb and assume you don't track the humidity because you didn't comment on it. Just because a snake had a shed you may have perceived to have gone well, doesn't mean it isn't becoming dehydrated. Reptiles are generally better at retaining water than mammals because of beta kerratin in their skin (different than beta carotene). But this makes them susceptible to long term dehydration and kidney failure. They show the negative signs only slightly until it is too late. This makes me think you may have a dehydrated snake as well. Don't assume you can fix the whole situation by hydrating it because that is also likely a symptom. At this point figure out how much intervention you provide for the snake and do it ASAP. Waiting at this point doesn't serve any purpose.
I don't want to play captain hindsight or lecture you, but these arent play things. They aren't science projects. They especially aren't things to lend to just anyone. These are animals that depend on a constant assurance of maintenance and stability. Sometimes breeding projects are done without any concern for the animals doing the actual work. In fact, breeding is probably the single most dangerous event in the average captive ball's life. The amount of unreplenished calories in deficit is staggering. Even for wild snakes breeding poses countless risks. If you cant provide the minimum requirements for your animals what urged you to breed? I am not coming out against the practice of breeding but standards must be ensured.
Basically I don't know how much business you or your uncle have in breeding snakes. I am sorry for the rant but this was probably going to he said by someone else.

[KMG]

Ok. That was better.

Yes it is true they often refuse to eat during a mating season. But if it refused to mate and eat it could have just been to much stress for it. If your snake is not use to interaction with people and then goes from you to your uncle, and is then introduced to a female it might have just been to much to fast.

I think if it was me I would let him settle back in for atleast 5 days and try to feed then.

The weight loss common during the mating process. That is why people build their snakes up in weight before the breeding season. Some breeders will also give females a year of breeding followed by a year off.

I would get him back on track and if you and your uncle plan to do this again I would change the process. Let your snake move in with your uncle before any pairing and get it established eating regularly with him. That way when the time for breeding comes he will be more used to the environment.

Nachash has a very good point with dehydration. I was giving your uncle the benefit of the doubt that his husbandry was correct. Being that we are not there and can only guess at what the problem may be, a vet visit may still be in order.

[Chiz]

Thanks alot for the both of you. Nachash and KMG.it make me feel a little better but still worried. i will contact a vet tomorrow. And update on the situation..
Well this will be the last time hes honna borrow my snake yo breed..

Thanks alot. Both of your help is so much appreciated.

[Annarose15]

A few more thougths to add to what's already been said:

1) When you offer food, offer something slightly smaller than you normally would (a rat weanling ~40g in this case).

2) Be prepared to offer live if needed just to get him back on feed again, especially since your uncle was feeding live.

3) Make sure he has a few snug-fitting hides in his tub to make him feel extra secure.

4) Don't offer food more than every 5 days if he refuses, so you don't stress him out further.

Good luck!

[Chiz]

Thanks annarose. I already call a vet. To check my lesser. And i got a relief. He is not dehydrated. The loose skin is cause by the off feed and sudden lost of weight.

Now the cause of off feed is the sudden change of environment. It gives to much stress on my lesser that is why he goes off feed. He advice me to settle him dow for 3-5days before giving food again..

Also too much stress is the cause of the big weight loss.

Thanks for all the help.. It is really much appreciated.

There aint gonna be a next time... I learned my lesson. And its the hard way...