Do you run fecals on your animals?

[spitzu]

We recently received a new animal from a reputable breeder. Last week I ran a routine fecal float on him and found some things that concerned me. I took the sample to the vet and had him send it up to a lab (IDEXX) so that we could get a specific diagnosis. The results came in today and it turns out that what we saw on our microscope was lungworm larva, and the lab found some eggs as well.

Again, the snake came from a reputable breeder who doesn't trust vets or bother running fecals because: " I never test a snakes stool if it's not sick. There is no telling what may typically be found in a snakes stool and as long as the snake eats, grows and breeds I leave well enough alone." In the last week I've heard variations of the same statement a lot.

Some people think I'm being overly paranoid by running routine fecals on new snakes. For those of you that share this opinion, does the above test result concern you at all? The dude has never left quarantine and we should be able to clear this up since he has no symptoms, but still... lungworms, and many other parasites, can be some scary little bugs if left untreated. I don't understand how many people seem to have such a cavalier attitude about this stuff.

There is quite a bit of time/energy/expense associated with running routine fecals and/or deworming a collection if necessary, but... is it okay to send animals across the country that carry the potential to not only develop an infection, but also have the potential to contaminate the rest of the buyer's collection? Or maybe it is an acceptable risk to your reputation as a breeder as long as the snakes are currently outwardly healthy. Ignorance is bliss?

[Skittles1101]

I basically got laughed at by some people when I told them I got fecals done on my animals. Basically, if I haven't physically seen where and who my snakes are coming from, I spend the extra $20 at my vet for a fecal. Worst case scenario is something is found and then have to bring him/her to the vet for treatment.

My first snake ever came back positive for pinworms, so I've just done it ever since.

[4Ballz]

never even thought about it, and I know I will now. I will call around vets to see the prices, and who does it. thanks

[WingedWolfPsion]

I pick several animals from my collection to run fecals on every year. I don't run them on all new arrivals, because the vets here will not run a fecal on an animal without seeing it first...that means $60 for the visit, plust $20 for the fecal, and $80 per animal is a bit steep when I buy them 10 at a time--for now. If any animal behaves abnormally or shows any signs in quarantine, of course they get tested.

If I have an animal in my collection (not in quarantine) test positive, I treat every animal it could possibly have contacted (all in the same rack, all bred with or that bred with its mate, anything that shared equipment with it, etc--even if that's the entire collection). In the future, however, I will have them done on all new arrivals. Once my collection's up well over 200 animals, it would be very silly not to.

I've also acquired a very good microscope, and plan to teach myself to screen them...if I spot anything, then I can have a vet confirm it and treat it. I expect it will take a few years to learn to read fecal floats reliably, and identify stuff, but I consider this a tremendously useful skill to save both time and money, and it will enable me to screen my entire collection regularly.

[1nstinct]

I did for the longest time. Untill I moved and broke my microscope. I did my own because I am a vet tech so I have been trained to do so. I also did some blood work on my ph albino, and a friends boa for a project while in school. Stopped doing decals untill I can buy another Microscope, need to save up $.

[John1982]

For those who do their own floats/smears, can you recommend a decent microscope that won't break the bank? Also, are there any posters/books with pictures of the parasites/eggs I'd be looking for?

Thanks,
John

[rdoyle]

So If I buy a bp should I ask if they did one them?

[1nstinct]

Understanding Reptile Parasites: A Basic Manual for Herpetoculturists & Veterinarians is a decent book about parasites in reptiles gives you techniques but is somewhat old. I used it a as a first reference, then checked the information thought my reptile textbook. There's other reptile disease and surgery books but they go up to over $200+
For microscopes price is anywhere from$200-2000+ I had one from my school that they were getting rid of because they got all new ones in. I havnt been really looking at microscopes yet because I can bring the fecals to my vet office and get them done for free since I use to work there for 5 years .

[Dwagon]

John-The book I use is Exotic Animal Medicine for the Veterinary Technician ISBN:9780813822068 (http://www.amazon.com/Exotic-Animal-...=9780813822068). I ordered several books from Amazon, but this one seems to be the best out of all of them. I am also a veterinary technician and it is really not a hard process to learn how to do fecal floats, I showed my husband a few times how to do it and he does it on a regular basis now without any problems. The microscope I use is the Celestron 44340 LCD Digital LDM Biological Microscope, this microscope has an LCD display (which I need because I can not see through a regular microscope after I had lasic because it is hard to focus close up) and also has the ability to take pictures and record small films, the light bulbs however are kinda crappy so I would suggest you order a few extra. You are able to download these images and films to your computer. (http://www.amazon.com/Celestron-4434...rds=microscope)

Do you run fecals on your animals?
I personally know the Veterinarian that we take our fecal samples too (I worked with him for awhile when he was doing an internship at the ER clinic I worked at) and he does not make me bring the animals in, he knows that I do not want to possibly expose my collection to something that may have been in the Vets office. You can find directions for fecal floats online and also how to make the fecasol from Epsom salt (this is really an inexpensive way). Regular IDEXX does not usually isolate the specific bugs and what species they are from, so we send ours out to Canada and the price is about $112 for this. We only do this if we see something in our fecal float from a new snake we have purchased and we keep strict quarantine procedures with rubber gloves, bleaching tubs etc. You can always take one animal in and pay the fee the first time and just submit future fecals under the same animal and should not have to take the snake in with the poop you drop off. You can always explain to the vet about the concerns you have with bringing your animals in because if you were to pick something up at the vet you could potentially expose all of your animals and it would be a HUGE financial loss to you. Many times Veterinarians will also teach you how to give your snake injections for RI infections and also show you how to tube feed de-worming medications like Panacur so you can do it at home.

I personally do not like how casual some people are about just selling an animal without checking for internal parasites before selling them. We have received a few animals from top of the line breeders that came to us appearing healthy and a few weeks later we had to euthanize them because they had two types of infections and were not responding to the dangerous Genamyacin we had to use. This is not a way to run a business and the negligence on the breeders part is unacceptable in my opinion. Ignorance is not OK in my book, especially when we recently received an animal that was positive for a dangerous internal parasite and told the breeder they sent out a sick animal, and the breeder is not willing to treat their collection and now are knowingly selling infected animals to other people. When the breeders response to us was to just send the animal back so he can resell it too someone else, it is also not OK. So we as the buyers are now in a position that if we really want the animal, we have to now treat it, which we are willing to do, but the seller not believing in veterinary care, and not willing to refund the medical costs is not OK in my book.

[John1982]

Thanks, I've done a few smears and floats back in the day. I remember the place had a couple posters above the fecal station with different parasites and eggs to help with identification - was kinda hoping similar posters had been made for reptiles.