Caging Question.. Need Advise

[luluizzi]

Ok so this will be sorta like a re-intrduction of myself and a quest for knowledge. I have been a member for quite some years and havent been on here in quite a while. I lost my collection to horriable husbandry on my part and have been reluctant to start again. Now that I am almost over my fear of failure I am doing to heavy lurking and reasearch.
I started off with glass terramiums and moved into a DIY rack that i was quite pleased with. My collection only grew to three "Classic" balls (just love that term), an adopted adult Iguana and unknow aged Leopard Gecko ( which is the sole surviror). As much as I loved my rack of tubs I had flex watt connction / temp regulation failure that eventually lead to the death of 2 of my balls and the sever injury resulting in death of another who was partially eaten by a feed that went horribly wrong. Due to uncontrollable financial and living situations i was unable to provide ideal husbandry for my pets. I relocated the iguana also due to these events (luckily).
OK so I am considering starting over again and have decided firstly on caging. I am thinking a AP T-8. Would love input on glass or acrylic for the door. Also any suggestions for how to set it up? I still have faith in flex watt but have read others suggesting not using it directly under sliding tubs(which was my set up previously and possibly my down fall). My intention is to eventually have a collection of two. Preferably males and I'm thinking that this cage would be ideal. I would love some feed back and suggestions on what stats work best and which flex watt to choose, I am also thinking having them install two 8" screens on the top so that I have an option for using heat lamps during the winter to help keep the ambient temps regulated during the winter as it gets pretty nippy down here and think that the extra control would be a nice option. I befriended a local breeder here years ago whom I will look to for purchasing my babies and help if needed ( i hope ). I am not looking to do this quickly maybe ordering the cage this winter and getting my first baby next season after I have purchased and maintained the correct set-up to possible perfection.
Any suggestions, comments, criticism and info from you guys would be very much appreciated.

Thank you Terra

[Daybreaker]

Sorry to hear about loosing your snakes. Was your flexwatt regulated with a thermostat when it overheated the tubs in your previous setup?

I don't know about Animal Plastics cages as I plan to build my own custom enclosures for my bigger species, but I have two racks currently for me and my bf's balls and we are having zero problems. We are using the sliding tubs - pretty much how all rack owners have it set up. We have flexwatt wired to a Vivarium Electronics VE-200 thermostat on each rack, here is where I get my flexwatt and thermostats: http://www.reptilebasics.com/index.php?p=home

When you get your two males will you be housing them together in that one AP cage? I might have misunderstood you.

[luluizzi]

Thank you for your response and condolences. My issue wasnt from over heating but under heating. We had a very harsh winter (30 days of temps below freezing which is rare for Mississippi) and I lived in an older home with horriable heating and hard wood foors and could not keep the ambient temps right. As much as I loved the ease of the tubs I would like to have a better display as well as the ability to maintain the temps and humidity. I thinking males for size and from what i've reasearched so far the AP T8 has an accessory divider. But is there a question of housing them seperatly in this fasion? I would think that it would not be as different as the rack i used previously. But if my thinking is worng on this please advise.

[I-KandyReptiles]

Have you considered a RHP?

In my PVC cage I have flexwatt for belly heat and an rhp to help ambient temps. Temps stay about 80 for ambient

[Daybreaker]

Thank you for your response and condolences. My issue wasnt from over heating but under heating. We had a very harsh winter (30 days of temps below freezing which is rare for Mississippi) and I lived in an older home with horriable heating and hard wood foors and could not keep the ambient temps right. As much as I loved the ease of the tubs I would like to have a better display as well as the ability to maintain the temps and humidity. I thinking males for size and from what i've reasearched so far the AP T8 has an accessory divider. But is there a question of housing them seperatly in this fasion? I would think that it would not be as different as the rack i used previously. But if my thinking is worng on this please advise.

I see nothing wrong with using a divider, I was asking because there's risks housing snakes together and wanted to see if that's what you wanted to do.

Have you looked into a room heater on a thermostat to keep ambient temps up? I think if you have a room designated for snakes then a space heater may be the way to go, especially if you may want to use a rack/tubs again. May be easier than heating your entire house to a ~80-84 degrees to keep the ambient temps in the tubs up to where they need to be.

I'd also look into radiant heat panels for the cage to bring ambient temps up, though I'm not sure how that would work in one cage that's divided in two (since usually the RHP is used on one side -that I'm aware of- since the snake still needs a hot and cold side).

[luluizzi]

RE RHP, I have considered those too. I saw in a very detailed thread re set up of PVC cage maybe by Aaron that RHP is also an option. I guess when I get my cage this winter and start working on temps I will sort all of that out. And I have learned enough from here to understand how bad an idea it would be to house two together, unless breeding. It will also be a while before I get a second snake, well thats the plan but you know how that usually works out . But it is good to get confirmation that the divider would be sufficient. I'm sure I read it here some where and it was mentioned in the set up thread, which I must say was awesome and should be a sticky. Thank you both for your responses. I can hardly wait to get started. Until that time I will continue to research and lurk. Also if any one could share advice as far as which type of door would be better glass or acrylic that would be helpful also. Thanks again.

[Kaorte]

I'm so sorry about your loss!!

I had a similar experience with a baby chameleon. I was doing everything right. The little guy was doing great for months but then I moved and he started to slowly deteriorate. I took him to the emergency vet and he passed away there. I love chameleons so much but I am so afraid to get another I know I was doing everything right, I did all my research and had a perfect setup and talked with the people on chameleon forums, but the little guy was just too sensitive to the move. I felt so bad. I was bawling at the vet over this tiny little creature. That was over a year ago and I am still wary of getting another. If I do I want an established adult.

Anyway! I think a T8 with a divider would be great for 2 males. RHP is also a good idea.

Welcome back!

[patientz3ro]

I believe that AP offers the option to have the RHP installed in the center of the T8, so that half would be on each side of the divider, so that is definitely an option. As for acrylic vs glass doors, I would suggest glass. Granted, acrylic is a bit more efficient in the insulation department, but it scratches a LOT more easily. Since you're wanting to have a better view of your boys, that's a big plus for glass. That being the case, I would consider having your ventilation along the back and/or sides of the T8, putting an RHP in the rear center, and keeping the top solid to help maintain temps and humidity. Also, considering the terrible loss you had to deal with before, I STRONGLY recommend the VE-200. It's not cheap, but I think it's well worth the money to know your animals are safe. Another thing worth mentioning is the drastic humidity change in the mid-south from season to season. I grew up about 200 miles north of you, in Memphis, and I still have nightmares about it! Late spring through early fall, your humidity is pretty impressive, but having the heat on during the winter sucks every last drop of moisture out of the air. If you've got central heat, it makes it worse. If at all possible, get a humidifier for the room that your snakes are in.

[luluizzi]

I have SO missed this forum and all of its contributors. I will be playing around with the cage in the winter so hopefully of i an maintain a good temp and humidity during that time, i will be successful. I find it so interesting to say the least how delicate reptiles can be and how on the other hand they have survived for millions of years (i assume). I want to be successful this time around and will not let my new little guy(s) down. Thank you so much for your input, knowledge and support.

[luluizzi]

Ok... Update. Well looks like I will be starting my much anticipated collection sooner than I had planned. I have the "Fever" now after being back on here again (BP.net) It is contagious, this love for reptiles. I will be beginning with babies and will do two tub set ups thanks to this very detailed thread by Vypyrz http://ball-pythons.net/forums/showt...e-Basics-*DUW*
I ordered a Hydrofarm t-stat and flexwatt today as well as got and Acurite and tub. But I would like to know if this sounds correct.
I bought two 25 qt steralites 24" in length, 5 foot of 3" flexwatt, aluminum foil tape, and will be using newspaper as substrate. They till be set up lengthwise on a table that is 54" long. In an are that I can easily control the temp with a heater if needed. I will still be ordering the T-8 later on but realize that babies wont need that much space.. YET. I should have everything in and set up in about a week or so and will post pics as soon as that happens. So please let me hear your thoughts and opinions on my proposed set up. It will be at least another month before I get my babies so I will have plenty of time to make changes. Also I may be getting an awesome deal from local breeder / fellow BP.netter / friend ... who is da bomb ... but am so heartbroken that I will not be getting my dream snake to start off with ( hottness in the form of ann Enchi Spider). Thanks for all and any help / suggestions / criticisms in advance