So Anyway....Whats the difference between

[spk329]

Mystics and Phantoms?

[MKHerps]

Believed to be same genes but differnet people's bloodline. Like Fire and Sulfur, Butter and Lesser, Sable and Chocolate, Yellowbelly and Goblin.

For example Ralph Davis got the Goblin, which was very unique looking. After breedings it turns up it was a Yellowbelly. He just calls his line the Goblins. If you saw the Goblin you would know why he didnt think it was a Yellowbelly at first.

[RandyRemington]

I think you are probably right about the others but not so sure about sable and chocolate. I have read where some think they might be alleles, i.e. different mutations of the same gene, like lesser and mojo. Maybe you are right and they are the same mutation of the same gene like many believe for lesser and butter.

One interesting test will be with spider. Recently I read that the spider and sable combo doesn't seem to survive. Has the sable chocolate combo been done?

How about sable and chocolate? Would not only be interesting to know what the combo looks like but if it can produce normals bred to a normal indicating they aren’t even alleles (i.e. they might be different mutations of different genes that just happen to have some similar appearance). I’m sure we’ll figure sable and chocolate out eventually if someone hasn’t already.

[mainbutter]

If you saw the Goblin you would know why he didnt think it was a Yellowbelly at first.

Yeah, WCs and CHs can be really funky looking sometimes! I think it just goes to show that we still have a fairly limited genepool in the captive population compared to the wild populations. We don't have anywhere near the variety that the whole wild population of BPs has.

[ChrisPar]

I have also read about the Sable Spider crosses not being able to survive. But, BHB Reptiles had a Chocolate Spider for sale on there website the other day, so that cross can survive.

ChrisP

[RandyRemington]

Thanks! Spider Chocolate is what I meant to write.

So the spider cross results would tend to indicate that chocolate and sable aren't the exact same mutations, even IF it does eventually get proven that they are mutations of the same gene.

[Bill Buchman]

I am working with 2 males -- one WC and the other CH -- that are proven dominate. I am breeding one to 4 of his 08 daughters to prove a super. The other I am pairing to make a Yellow belly combo.

I believe both males to be SUPERS. They are hyper-melanistic and are as close in appearance to a Super Chocolate than anything else. I plan to pick-up a Chocolate in the coming year to see if they are compatible. Based on what I have seen with other "similar looking morph pairings" -- it will be a 50/50 shot at compatibility. This is the kind of stuff that charges me up. I am still learning about the finer points of genetics -- fun stuff!!!