Gross ASF Tumor/Warts/? Need Suggestions

[PigsnPythons]

First noticed it in a soon-to-be retired breeder male. At first I thought it was just bite marks from a female that got cranky, but then it started looking more tumor like. He was the only one in his colony (1.3) that had them. I fed them all off about a month ago just because it was time. From that feeding I had my first ever regurge. All my temps/humidity/etc are spot on...I don't know if the snake that regurged got the "tumor" rat. All the other snakes ate their rats fine.

Then, I started noticing this colony. Of the 4 rats in the group, 3 have the "tumors" and one doesn't have any at all.









What do you think it is? Tumors? Warts?
Is it from in-breeding? (these rats are very inbreed...i just set up my new blood groups in the fall)
Is it a virus? If so do you think its contagious? Can I get it?
Should I cull all the rats or just the ones with the "tumors"?
Is it safe to feed them to my snakes?
Two of the females are pregnant, is it worth waiting on those babies?

[PigsnPythons]

Bump...no suggestions?

[greghall]

They all get it to some degree or another females mostly after They start breeding,I have not noticed it till they are breeding for a few months dont know what it is but it very common.May be a form of herpes or some type of virus.I always feed them off when it gets real bad like that,feed him off its got to be misrable for him.

[m00kfu]

Stolen from Connie's (littleindiangirl) ASF page on our site... http://www.metalmonkeyexotics.com/blog/?page_id=333

Tumors

ASF's are prone to spontaneous, fast growing warty tumors. From my readings in various papers, the warty and ulcer like tumors known as keratoacanthomas and squamous carcinomas, are associated with a papillomavirus (MnPV). The tumors can be seen in the vaginal region as a clustered mass, along the tail as bumps, on the back and hind quarters as warty black growths, or on the face of the animal. (Pictures can be found here)

They will develop warty tumors, patchy hairloss, and osteoarthritis as they age past approx 9 months, although it can be younger, or delayed as much as 14 months, or not at all.

So far, it would seem that the tumors develop after 9 -12months of age, although not all will get this condition.I have at least one Amber colored female well over 14 months of age that still has not developed any skin tumors or growths.

The tumor development can be very fast and spontaneous. I've had one female just recently (6/1) who within days developed fast growing tumors all over her body, under the skin and on the skin surface. I should have taken a picture, but I didn't remember to before she was euthanized and destroyed. It was disturbing to see the alarming rate that the tumors grew, she had just reached approximately 8-9 months of age when these tumors developed.

I suggest keeping rats for at least 9 months of age and hold back animals from colonies that are less susceptible to the tumors.

They are also prone to stomach cancer, which is one of the main reasons these animals are used in research.

You can google "squamous cell carcinoma mastomys natalensis" and read many articles (some you have to pay for) that discuss the virus and the cause of these tumors. (I have linked to many articles at the bottom of this entry)

I know she had mentioned a theoretical way to get rid of them at one point, and maybe now that we're cutting back on producing them we'll actually get to try it. From my understanding, the virus that causes these is NOT passed on during the first few weeks of their lives. So if you were to take a new born litter, and successfully foster it with mice or rats and completely cull the rest of your colony, you should end up with a group of ASF's that won't end up with tumors. I'm not sure if this has been done successfully or not, dealing with all the rodent stuff is Connie's department around here -- I just feed them to the snakes. If I remember, I'll ask her about it tomorrow or maybe even get her to hop on here and get a little more specific.

[nixer]

Stolen from Connie's (littleindiangirl) ASF page on our site... http://www.metalmonkeyexotics.com/blog/?page_id=333



I know she had mentioned a theoretical way to get rid of them at one point, and maybe now that we're cutting back on producing them we'll actually get to try it. From my understanding, the virus that causes these is NOT passed on during the first few weeks of their lives. So if you were to take a new born litter, and successfully foster it with mice or rats and completely cull the rest of your colony, you should end up with a group of ASF's that won't end up with tumors. I'm not sure if this has been done successfully or not, dealing with all the rodent stuff is Connie's department around here -- I just feed them to the snakes. If I remember, I'll ask her about it tomorrow or maybe even get her to hop on here and get a little more specific.

thats wierd when i had them i never got that! and i know of others who have/had them and they didnt have this either

[m00kfu]

It's definitely possible! Either you were lucky enough to get some that didn't carry that virus or were feeding them off fast enough that it didn't have time to show itself.

[PigsnPythons]

Thank you so much for posting that. I've been breeding them for two years now and have never seen anything like this. I assumed that it was something new and weird and didn't even do a search for it. It makes me feel a little better that its not just some random attack. I guess I've been very lucky so far not to have seen any tumors.

So is it safe to feed them off? I'm going to wait on at least one of the pregnant ones because she only has a few and I don't think her quality of life is suffering.

Thanks again!

[m00kfu]

Thank you so much for posting that. I've been breeding them for two years now and have never seen anything like this. I assumed that it was something new and weird and didn't even do a search for it. It makes me feel a little better that its not just some random attack. I guess I've been very lucky so far not to have seen any tumors.

So is it safe to feed them off? I'm going to wait on at least one of the pregnant ones because she only has a few and I don't think her quality of life is suffering.

Thanks again!

I haven't run into any problems feeding them off yet.