Can a baby ball accidently drown?

[Chocolate Muffin's]

Hi everyone,

I am like most folks in the winter, keeping a close watch on the humidity in my glass BP cages. I have learned from my new adult BP (Nico) that she likes to soak in the water dish. I originally didn’t have a dish big enough so I went to the store and bought her a punch bowl to soak in. She barely fits in it, but she loves it! – This also had another desired side affect, it raised the humidity to a constant 67% from 37%.

I’d like to put a large bowl like this in my baby ball’s (Muffin) cage to raise her humidity, but I’m terrified that she might accidentally fall in and drown. She never soaks in her water dishes. I have 2 humid hides in her cage along with 2 water dishes, misting daily, and it’s still not enough – Poor Muffin. So when Nico came along, and I added the punchbowl of water, it seemed to make a substantial and sustainable difference in humidity.

Is it possible that I could be putting my baby ball Muffin at risk for drowning by adding such an enormous body of water in her cage?

I’d love to hear all replies and suggestions. This humidity issue is my number one source of frustration and concern for my precious animals.

Thanks for reading my post, sorry if this should go under 'husbandry'

Chocolate Muffin & Nico Wilson’s Mamma

[CoolioTiffany]

Accidents can always happen. Have you tried considering using tubs?

[wilomn]

As long as the sides are not too high, you should be fine. The snake needs to be able to get it's head out of the bowl while touching the bottom with enough of its body to push itself out.

Stay away from bowls that are sloped. Stick with vertical sides.

[Chocolate Muffin's]

Hi CT,
I don;t have a way to heat the tubs. I need to have UTH and Overhead heat lamps, and that wont work with a tub. I bought tubs to use for Nico but none of the pet stores in my area sell heat tape. I tried a bunch. I could order it online, but they says it requires a rheostat? (sp) Or some other device or which I'm not really familiar. I asked the vet if I could use an UTH wrapped in a towel, on the tubs, and he said no. He said the UTH needs to have ventilation and to put her in the glass cage for now.

I love my pretty cages, but Nico is going to need something considerably bigger...sorry, I digress...

[Chocolate Muffin's]

As long as the sides are not too high, you should be fine. The snake needs to be able to get it's head out of the bowl while touching the bottom with enough of its body to push itself out.

Stay away from bowls that are sloped. Stick with vertical sides.

Oh really? Well then this punch bowl won't work. It has sloped sides and she would be like a shoe in pool. There is no chance that this would be safe, sounds like?

[wilomn]

Oh really? Well then this punch bowl won't work. It has sloped sides and she would be like a shoe in pool. There is no chance that this would be safe, sounds like?

For a big snake, it's no problem. The little guys though can't get any purchase on the bottom and if they can't pull themselves out by their chins, they get tired and drown.

I lost a some baby rubber boas this way long ago. It was a really cool bowl, but had sloped sides and I came in one morning and found 2 dead babies in the bowl. They had drowned. I've only used vertical sided since then for the babies.

[Chocolate Muffin's]

I'm so sorry that happened to you. I will not be doing the big bowl idea. I'm sure glad I asked...thought I was brilliant once I discovered it.


Thanks!

[Kaorte]

I am a little concerned that your other ball python likes to soak so much. Ball pythons aren't normally the soaking type and excessive soaking is usually an indication of a bigger problem.

What kind of hides are you using for your snakes?

Also, you need to use a reptile thermostat with a UTH. Even with a glass tank, burns can still happen. This could be the reason why your snake chooses to sit in the water bowl instead of in the hide.

There are other ways to bring up humidity. Insulating the sides and back on the tank with foam core board (on the outside of the tank) can help hold in temps better and maybe eliminate the need for a CHE or lamp, which in turn will raise the humidity.

What substrate are you using? There are certain substrates that can help raise humidity.

Covering 3/4ths of the screen lid with aluminum tape will also help to trap humidity that would otherwise be lost.

A big bowl is not always the answer to keeping humidity up.

[771subliminal]

Hi CT,
I don;t have a way to heat the tubs. I need to have UTH and Overhead heat lamps, and that wont work with a tub. I bought tubs to use for Nico but none of the pet stores in my area sell heat tape. I tried a bunch. I could order it online, but they says it requires a rheostat? (sp) Or some other device or which I'm not really familiar. I asked the vet if I could use an UTH wrapped in a towel, on the tubs, and he said no. He said the UTH needs to have ventilation and to put her in the glass cage for now.

I love my pretty cages, but Nico is going to need something considerably bigger...sorry, I digress...

http://www.bigappleherp.com/Flex-Watt-Heat-Tape

[Chocolate Muffin's]

I am a little concerned that your other ball python likes to soak so much. Ball pythons aren't normally the soaking type and excessive soaking is usually an indication of a bigger problem.

What kind of hides are you using for your snakes?

Also, you need to use a reptile thermostat with a UTH. Even with a glass tank, burns can still happen. This could be the reason why your snake chooses to sit in the water bowl instead of in the hide.

There are other ways to bring up humidity. Insulating the sides and back on the tank with foam core board (on the outside of the tank) can help hold in temps better and maybe eliminate the need for a CHE or lamp, which in turn will raise the humidity.

What substrate are you using? There are certain substrates that can help raise humidity.

Covering 3/4ths of the screen lid with aluminum tape will also help to trap humidity that would otherwise be lost.

A big bowl is not always the answer to keeping humidity up.

Hi Kaorte,
Thanks for your questions:

Nico has only been with me since Tuesday. That’s when she shipped in and I got her from a very well known ball python breeder. She only soaked for about an hour yesterday, and I agree, it’s a behavior I’m familiar with but until this point, I had never seen. I looked on RC Reptiles ‘Ron’s Blog’ and it said BP soak for lots of reasons, but one could be because their cage is too hot. When I checked Nico’s temps, her hide was at 110 degrees – way too hot. I brought the temps down, and got the ambient temp down to 82, and she was fine and hasn’t soaked since. She has absolutely no health/parasitic issues and she looked amazing when she arrived on Tuesday (still does).

Nico’s hide box is a standard breeder hide box, XL, from LLReptile. She’s 4530 grams, and only has room for 1 hide. The baby ball Muffin has 2 hides (1/2 log & Rock) and 2 humid hide boxes.

I have 2 digital thermostats and Humidity meters in both cages. I know what their numbers are every second of the day, which is why I knew Nico was too hot, and that Muffins humidity was too low.

The substrate issue is a great issue you bring up. I spend a great deal of time analyzing this issue before I got Muffin. I settled on reptile carpet for both animals, but have discovered that I like paper towels much more. I have mentally debated getting Aspen/Cypress Mulch to help with the humidity for Muffin, but found that paper towels absorb urine well, and clean up much easier. I don’t know. I keep their cages pristine, and I feel like I would be obsessing over their cages even more with mulch in them…I dunno

I do have ¾ the top covered with foil, but I read recently on this forum to try a wet blanket – I really liked this idea, so I cleaned out Muffin’s cage about ½ hour ago, and I am trying the wet towel routine…let me quick go check her numbers: 48% humidity, 97 degrees – sheesh.