Will my python ever recover?

[Bogertophis]

A stable step-ladder is an easy alternative to "building a jungle gym", but either way, you can wrap some rope or even rags around parts of it for better grip (traction). Do make sure it resists tipping though- that's admittedly harder to do with a big & very strong snake.

I personally use a lot of natural branches for my snakes: I angle them crosswise in their tanks so they cross over & interlock in the middle, which keeps them very stable. (You can make sure they don't slip by using a twist wire- no sharp edges please!- or a zip-tie for more strength & permanence.) My snakes love to climb on them & often rest in/on their branches.

As already mentioned though, a snake that's never had these things may take a while before they'll use them- but don't let that stop you. The sooner you provide them, the sooner your snake will explore them, & that exploration may improve appetite as well.

You CAN totally fix this, y'know.

[leosantare]

Yes, I have known Ari for many years and spoke to him recently. He is the one who told me about Newsprint and doesn't see a problem with it. I have been using Newsprint since she was a yearling and think it's great. It a good substrate for an enclosure that is always exposed to moisture. For example, it dries very quickly, before another misting cycle begins. Up until this started she would move all around her cage no problem with Newsprint. I plan on sticking with Newsprint.

She has not been in this enclosure for 11 years! She was in two smaller enclosures before hand. She has been in this enclosure for 5-6 years. It's easy to furnish and clean small enclosures. Plus, everything is affordable with small enclosures. This is not the case with large enclosures. Remember my enclosure is always being exposed to moisture so I can only put certain materials inside. Things that are rot proof and non porous, like plastic. Otherwise, I will end up with a lot of bacteria/mold and have a different problem. My point is, I did look into having natural looking things custom made out of epoxy, but it was way too expensive. I simply thought being sterile is most important.

Yes, I agree her enclosure is pretty bare and I was thinking she might depressed/bored. I went out and got a plastic step stool last night, thanks for the idea! I will post a pic tonight. Anymore immediate, plastic enrichments?

However being bored/depressed doesn't cause weight loss. If fact sitting around doing nothing while eating larger meals should do the opposite. She should be gaining weight instead.

I tried feeding her slightly larger meals and all that did was cause her to become very impacted. She also was going into back to back sheds. She seems to be pooping regularly/normally now and want to keep it that way. Plus, I was told by a very experienced boelens keeper not to feed them jumbo rats/small rabbits. I posted a picture of her after eating a 300g chicken and she looks pretty uncomfortable. I will post some xrays showing how impacted she was along with her "enlarged heart" according to the vet. In case I didn't mention it, her last bloodwork came back with low white and red blood cell counts.

I will try feeding her larger items again, exactly what should I be feeding her? I feel like I have been asking this the whole time.


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[leosantare]

Her appetite is great, always has been. She has never refused a meal.

I was wondering if her metabolism changed from the antibiotics and from feeding her larger rats.

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[Bogertophis]

...I will try feeding her larger items again, exactly what should I be feeding her? I feel like I have been asking this the whole time.


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You may have been asking, but also not reading some great replies you've gotten:
https://ball-pythons.net/forums/show...=1#post2782893

[Bogertophis]

Her appetite is great, always has been. She has never refused a meal.

I was wondering if her metabolism changed from the antibiotics and from feeding her larger rats.

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Antibiotics have a very negative effect on the digestive system- true for snakes as well as humans & others. Most of us find that adding probiotics to their meals after a course of antibiotics to be very helpful, since antibiotics destroy the good gut bacteria along with whatever infection they're intended to cure. Without adequate gut bacteria, the digestion is poor with nutrients NOT being fully absorbed. There are various products designed to replenish the gut bacteria in snakes: Nutribac & Bene-Bac have both been around a long time, & there are likely other options by now as well, for which you can search for what's available in your area. Never give these WHILE a snake is on antibiotics- only AFTER the course of treatment is done.

[Caitlin]

I've been thinking about your snake's enclosure. I understand the concerns with a high-moisture environment. One of my snakes is a Brazilian Rainbow Boa and I maintain her humidity at 90-99%.

The photo below is the 8' enclosure a friend maintains for her Boa. It's just an example of the level of environmental complexity that helps snakes maintain good physical condition and mental health.

I understand that you have your own preferences and concerns about how to set up Jasmine's enclosure. Knowing that, here are some things I would consider in order to provide environmental complexity:

Large potted plants in the enclosure. Live plants would be great but even artificial small trees would be good.

A big kitty litter pan filled with substrate that she can poke around in. Alternatively or in addition, a big pan filled with shredded paper towel that she can poke around in. Another thing she might enjoy for textures is a container with smooth river rock.

Hang double-braided nylon boat rope at a couple of levels. The rope is easily cleaned by just washing it in a bucket with warm water and mild dish soap.

Pavers or decorative rock or even stone floor tiles at one end or corner of the enclosure for some variety in texture.

Consider adding a big sisal cat tree. Sisal is easy to clean.

I would enthusiastically recommend this wooden climbing toy for toddlers. I recently got one and my larger snakes are just loving this thing. The wood can be easily sealed to eliminate concerns about moisture. https://tinyurl.com/5n85msm7

This shelf is available in 2 or 3 tiers: https://tinyurl.com/2trdsfwt

If you or anyone you know are DIY-ish you can use sheets of PVC from Home Depot to put some big shelves on the walls.

I have zero concerns about tossing cardboard boxes into my snake enclosures weekly as a temporary enrichment item - even with my snakes that require high humidity, mold is not an issue for that short time span. The same is true of piles of crumpled packing paper. You can crumple some of her newsprint substrate and pile it up for her to explore.

For a PVC pipe climbing area, you can hot glue twine around the pipe to make it more grippy. It's easy to pick it off and replace if needed.

I hope this helps.

[leosantare]

Hey, thanks for all the suggestions. However, this has nothing to do with her environment. I've had her outside in the yard a lot this summer. I put her on a 6ft ladder for a while and then let her move around in the grass. Although, she doesn't move around much even when outside. She still hasn't missed a meal but her body condition keeps getting worse.

Early on, she just had the loose/folded skin by her neck. Now, its going down her entire body. I was hoping it was from the antibiotics but that seems very unlikely at this point. As I mentioned, I reached out to Ari and he really has no clue what is wrong with her. Although, he does acknowledge that something is wrong. The only thing we came up with is to try changing the food source. I really don't think this is the problem but I will give it a try. After this, there isn't much else I can do.

She just doesn't seem to be processing food properly. It's as if the food dissappears after she eats it and she never ate anything. It has to be metabolic. I thought mabey when I increased the rodent size a few months back and she started shedding every 6-7 weeks, it messed up metabolism. Either way, I will be switching her over to cold blooded cafe from Rodent Pro tomorrow.

I'm not feeding her (1) extra large rat every 10 days anymore because every time I do, she ends up becoming impacted. Now, I'm feeding her (2) medium/large rats every 10 days instead. Ari is going to visit me next month. If her body condition doesn't improve/gains weight by then, I will relinquish her to him.

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[Bogertophis]

Did you ever TRY adding the probiotics to her meals? That has everything to do with how well she processes her food.

[leosantare]

Yes, I did. Although, I stopped after a while since there was no improvement.

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[Bogertophis]

Yes, I did. Although, I stopped after a while since there was no improvement.

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So maybe it wasn't enough? As previously discussed, antibiotics harm both good and bad bacteria- & the good bacteria is essential to digest their food.

Think about it: This snake had a lot of medical treatment- that affects their health, & it's not always without harm. With snakes, it's a fine line between getting them well or making them worse off. Some of the worst outcomes I've seen in snakes are where the vet used multiple medications* on them, especially when given/used simultaneously. Snakes are more delicate than they seem- they don't handle this stuff well, not like some other pets that vets may do this with. It might have something to do with them being so stoic & hard to read also- it's hard to know when it's too much- until it's too late. Also, change (improvement) can be very slow in snakes- like "watching paint dry".

*And granted, snakes where a vet gave multiple meds were very sick to start with, but I'm just saying that's my impression- that simultaneous meds given to snakes often seem to backfire. Note, I'm a long time keeper, not a vet, not a vet tech. Just offering my impressions though, because I've seen a lot, & question plenty. I often remind others that it's far easier to keep a snake healthy than to get them well again if they get sick. FYI, I've had a number of snakes live into their mid-20's. I've been at this a while.