Smallest female successfully bred?

[JenH]

This thread has some great info. Still wondering, though, how many that have bred smaller (900-1200 gram) females have had the female die from breeding them too early/small/young? Is it a really low percentage? If so, is that because most just don't breed at that size? Or would it be because it's less of a problem than most make it out to be? I always have a lot of questions...

I've never heard of a small girl dying because of laying eggs too early - if she is ready she will develop follicles and lay or not. If she is small she will just lay smaller eggs or few eggs. I have a few 3+ year old girls that are between 1000gms and 1500gms. I started pairing them and 3 of them started eating and I think they are going to go. One girl, a pied, is doing nothing.... She is frustrating!!

I have heard of females getting eggbound and having issues, but I'm not convinced that is a small snake issue.

[h00blah]

I have a 1200 gram girl who is not skinny by any stretch LOL, but she is also 4 years old. Based on all the information here, it seems that most of you guys would try to breed her. I personally don't want to because she's still eating like a champ, growing (she's in shed), and her personality is the same as it was 2 years ago. Once she skips a meal, or starts to act weird, I'll see about putting a male with her... She means a lot to me, and I just feel like she'll let me know when she's ready to breed.. I also don't want to throw a male at her, then shut down her feeding response... Love that big ol snake

[Brandon Osborne]

I'll contribute my list later this evening when my day is winding down. I find it a little funny seeing some make comments like "I would never breed a female that small or young. Only an inexperienced keeper would do such a thing." To me this is the mindset of the inexperienced. Results to follow.

[Zombie]

I have a 3 year old spider female going right now (should have an ovy soon), she was 1050g when she started and is up to 1300g now. Kevin McCurly (NERD) says their breeding weights start at 1000g in his book "The Complete Ball Python". Like many others on here, I believe it's about body condition and age more than weight. This is a great thread


EDIT: <--------- YAY, 400 posts

[Brandon Osborne]

Here is a little list of results from a few of my girls.

2002 het Pied:
2005 First clutch is produced at just under 3 years old at around 2500 grams. 9 fertile eggs, 9 healthy hatchlings, 4 Pieds.
2006 8 more eggs, 8 hatchlings and 4 more Pieds.
2007 11 eggs, 11 hatchlings, 7 Pieds.
2008 10 eggs, 10 hatchlings, 5 Pieds.
2009 13 eggs, 13 hatchlings, don't remember the count due to so many other pieds.
2010 14 eggs, 14 hatchlings, Pied count(?).
2011 13 eggs, 13 hatchlings, 4 Pieds...bad odds.
Current weight 5500 grams....as high as the scale will go.

2005 Pied
2007 First breeding at just under 2 years old around 1800 grams. 5 eggs and 5 Pieds.
2008 6 eggs and 6 Pieds.
2009 7 eggs and 7 Pieds.
2010 9 eggs and 9 Pieds.
2011 8 eggs and 8 Pieds.
Current weight 2800 grams

2006 Pewter
2008 First breeding at just under 2 years old around 1300 grams. 5 eggs, 3 Pewters, 1 Pastel and 1 normal.
2009 7 eggs, 2 Pewter, 2 Cinny, 1 Pastel, 2 normals.
2010 8 eggs, 2 Super Pewters, 1 Super Pastel, 1 Super Cinny, 2 Cinny, and 2 normals.
2011 7 Eggs, 1 Silver Bullet, 1 Super Cinny, 1 Super Pastel, and I don't remember the rest because I was enamored by the Bullet and the Supers.
Current weight 2800 grams

Some of the not so productive.
2003 Pastel
2007 at over 3 years old and around 1600 grams. 5 eggs, 3 Pastels, 2 normals.
2009 5 eggs, 1 Super Pastel, 2 Pastels, 2 normals.
Has not produced since.
Current weight 2600 grams.

2007 Pastel het Pied
2009 First breeding at around 1400 grams. 4 eggs, 1 Pastel Pied, 1 Pied, 2 normals.
2010 5 eggs and 5 healthy offspring.
2011 5 eggs, 4 healthy offspring, 1 slug.
Current weight 1800 grams

2007 Pastel het Pied
2010 First breeding at around 1500 grams. 3 eggs, 3 healthy offpring.
2011 3 eggs, 1 infertile, 1 full-term dead, 1 died at around 2 months. 1 retained egg that was laid about 30 days after.
Current weight 1600 grams.

Some I'm trying for the first time in the 2012 season.
2009 Pewter het Pied: Ovulate, shed, and awaiting eggs. 1800 grams.
2009 Pewter het Pied: Still actively breeding but I'm not expecting anything. 1400 grams
2010 Pewter Pied: Actively breeding but still feeding. 1900+ grams

As I've mentioned before, the Pastel gene could be at play with my poor results. I just don't like pastels because of their reluctant feeding response and inconsistency.

I have never experienced, or ever heard of a documented death from breeding females consistently or at an early age. It has all been hearsay. I've seen just as many slugs come from large girls as I have from small girls. In over 20 years of breeding snakes, I can say I've seen nation-wide cycles of bad seasons and good seasons, with colubrids and pythons alike. It seems to be a trend among a large number of breeders across the country. Breeding of any animal will take a toll on its health, at any age. It all depends on how the individual can handle the stress. I have experienced egg binding in only one female Ball ever. This is shown in the above list and she was already a proven breeder. You just don't hear of it often if ever. They are not complex animals and their only need in life is to eat and procreate.

As for breeding young girls at low weights being irresponsible, they will breed when they are ready. If they are not, they simply will not breed. I'm not a believer of age being a big factor. I think it's more about maturity and condition of the individual animal. Some breed early and some later. Inexperience tells a lot, experience tells the facts.