A question about a substrate I found out about.

[jclaiborne]

In addition can you please link your sources related to springtails being able to thrive everywhere and causing irritation in human skin, as I have found no conclusive evidence related to that statement. Springtails thrive in moist environments and feed on fungi, so I don't see how they can thrive in a home, unless there is a mold problem with constant high humidity...I did read that there is some speculation that it was originally thought that they could be parasitic to humans, however there wasn't any scientific data to back that up either.

The only reference I have found was a statement that the hairs from one specific species could cause irritation, and that some "bites" were thought to be from that.

[jclaiborne]

Well, I formed my opinion after doing a lot of research on the topic and doing research on the insects you but into the soil, I just don't like the idea as one of my kids already has sensitive skin and has had problems with getting rashes and so on. I could say they same with the soil because neither one of the insects I have seen isopods and springtails don't clean out microbials or mites (found on many forums people saying their bioactive soil didn't keep them away or stop them), but I will say they are really good at clean up the drops and such. The amount of money that is wasted just kinda hurts if someone were to get a mite infestation. Oh and some species of Isopods people use actually can cause wood damage and most houses are made in some way, shape, or form of wood. I really like they way they look and all because they are beautiful but Risk vs reward.

Springtails as skin irritants or skin parasites deserve much more scientific scrutiny. Given that the psychotic variant of such infestation has received a lot more scientific interest than the actual infestation itself, risks are that some infestations are too easily categorized as delusional. The main reason is obvious: nothing or very little is known about irritating, allergic or parasitic Springtails that cause contact dermatitis. Only a few cases are actually documented and therefore money for further scientific research is wanting.



Collembola, also known as springtails, are primitive organisms defined as hexapods, but they are often mistaken for mites. As inhabitants of fertile soil, they are considered to be the most abundant macroscopic organisms on earth. In recent years, much evidence has surfaced that springtails could be the culprit behind mysterious itching and crawling sensations experienced by victims of Delusional Parasitosis.

• Researchers at the Oklahoma State Department of Health took skin samples from 20 patients diagnosed with Delusional Parasitosis and found Collembola in 18 of the 20 patients.

• In an unrelated investigation conducted in Sweden, Dr. Frans Janssens and his colleague, Dr. Kenneth A. Christiansen, collected scores of reports regarding human springtail infestation from homeowners, doctors and pest control operators around the world, including many regions of the United States. Within the gray areas between casual testimony and medical documentation, a startling picture emerged. Springtails are everywhere, and it’s not impossible for them to latch onto people.

• Professor MJ Dumanov, an internationally recognized medical mycologist who inspects homes and public facilities to analyze environmental contaminants, states that collembola found in homes with fungal mold identified on human skin is often misdiagnosed as Delusional Parasitosis. Dumanov actively encourages physicians and psychiatrists to consider mold infestations when questioning patients who suffer from mysterious itching and crawling sensations.

Luckily they do not carry anything harmful and can not transmit anything. I feel like if the reptile community is going to start promoting it people need to tell that the insects aren't exactly harmless. I get that people want to replicate a natural environment for their reptiles but at the same time, I feel there has to be a better way then possibly releasing something in their enclosure that has the potential to cause problems for humans.

Again, they thrive in moist environments and areas where mold is found. The 18 out of 20 skin samples was found to be a result of error, I have found no documentation of conclusive evidence, below are the notes of an entire study performed, with controls and the outcome. It even references the 18 out of 20 test you reference above.


https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC3011850/

[Coluber42]

I assume that the sensitivity you're potentially concerned about is in the ballpark of minor irritation, not a major allergic reaction, right? Is there any reason you couldn't go get some springtails from whatever source you'd get them from and have the kid with sensitive skin handle them and some associated dirt to check for a reaction?

In any case, I would think that even if the bugs themselves have some possibility of causing irritation with lots of direct contact, you'd have to be doing a whole lot of prolonged and messy digging in the dirt to experience it. Maybe you'd have messy contact like that while doing the initial setup, but the whole point is that after that you mostly leave it alone. You don't go digging it up all over the place all the time beyond removing the biggest chunks of solid waste.
I could be totally off here, but it seems to me that it would take an pretty potent irritant for it to fill the soil to the point where contact with a snake living on it would cause irritation.

But in any case, springtails are incredibly widespread. There are many species and they basically live everywhere there is soil or anything like soil. I would hazard a guess that it would be much easier to cause an infestation in the house by tracking dirt in on people's shoes than because you had some in a bioactive tank. And that assumes that there is a hospitable environment for them in the house in the first place.

Basically, it seems like even the worst case scenario for springtails being potentially irritating could be avoided by wearing gloves to go digging in the dirt and vacuuming up any that spilled on the floor, which you would presumably do anyway.

[InquisitorXIII]

I assume that the sensitivity you're potentially concerned about is in the ballpark of minor irritation, not a major allergic reaction, right? Is there any reason you couldn't go get some springtails from whatever source you'd get them from and have the kid with sensitive skin handle them and some associated dirt to check for a reaction?

In any case, I would think that even if the bugs themselves have some possibility of causing irritation with lots of direct contact, you'd have to be doing a whole lot of prolonged and messy digging in the dirt to experience it. Maybe you'd have messy contact like that while doing the initial setup, but the whole point is that after that you mostly leave it alone. You don't go digging it up all over the place all the time beyond removing the biggest chunks of solid waste.
I could be totally off here, but it seems to me that it would take an pretty potent irritant for it to fill the soil to the point where contact with a snake living on it would cause irritation.

But in any case, springtails are incredibly widespread. There are many species and they basically live everywhere there is soil or anything like soil. I would hazard a guess that it would be much easier to cause an infestation in the house by tracking dirt in on people's shoes than because you had some in a bioactive tank. And that assumes that there is a hospitable environment for them in the house in the first place.

Basically, it seems like even the worst case scenario for springtails being potentially irritating could be avoided by wearing gloves to go digging in the dirt and vacuuming up any that spilled on the floor, which you would presumably do anyway.

I couldn't, not because she plays in the dirt and she has been taken to the doctor for skin irritation before and she doesn't even like to play in the dirt. But through research when the doctor did a skin culture on my daughter she said they were Collembola at the time I didn't know those were springtails until last night. She got a horrible rash and itched at it like crazy, she even made herself bleed on her arm all from just going within 10 feet of mulch pile at her grandparents so I don't want to bring these things into my home. They can also get out of the tank as springtails are related fleas and can jump extremely well and I personally would rather not go through another rash episode with her because as a parent it is not fun to see your own in pain. Another reason why I didn't feel like continuing to argue I just feel people would have respected medical journals over some random person on the internet and is the other reason why i didn't bring it up earlier is because someone could just say "your some random person on the internet how do i know this is true". So I tried to provide sufficient evidence that they can cause issues but hey there is only so much I can do. I guess the better option would have to dig up the doctor's notes from a year ago but I really don't feel like it because I don't know where they are off the top of my head. If people want to take my word on that it is up to them I'm just going to say there are better options and maybe people with sensitive skin shouldn't do this. Just one more thing tho I'm not condoning this at all, it is a cool idea but there every place everyone thinks it all hunky dory but the truth is it is not there can be issues even with this.

[InquisitorXIII]

And I loved this idea at the beginning it sound awesome to have in your house but after looking into it I don't like it anymore.

[Coluber42]

Fair enough, I didn't mean to imply that your daughter's skin issue isn't real. Maybe there are other kinds of cleanup bugs you can use instead; I've never done it, so I don't know. Best of luck either way.
Edit to add: I've never done it, but I do think that bioactive setups are really cool in principle; I am just enough of an idealist that I hate it when someone can't do something cool that they were interested in for reasons beyond their control.

[jclaiborne]

You don't have to use springtails at all, there are a ton of isopods that can be used, as well as earthworms, like I said before you are just trying to develop an eco system in your tank. Outside of that there isn't a dead set rule on the bugs you have to add, I even have dubia roaches roaming around in my biggest cage...