Help Please....

[hoax]

I have a trio of ASF's I have had them about two weeks now.

They have been acting fine up until today. I went to clean their cage today and they were acting kinda jumpy when I was trying to pick them up and were trying to bite me.

I clean out their cage with a 10% bleach 90% water mix, wiped it down twice with paper towels, put in fresh aspen, water, new hopper and food.

I go back in to check on them and one of the females is laying on her back panting VERY hard and the male was next to her panting hard (I don't think they were trying to procreate). I rolled her over and she just kinda laid there panting. I left her alone for a little bit. I go back in there to check on her again about 15 min later and she was laying on her side still panting, and the other 1.1 were in the corner huddled up. I picked her up and she did nothing didn't wiggle didn't squirm nothing.... just panting....

A few other questions....

The females are about twice the size of the male. Is this normal?

Is there any one in the D/FW area with ASF's? I would like to buy some from another source. Just to have a fresh line of blood.

[Mike Cavanaugh]

unless they are much younger, the males should never be smaller then the females.

I have never experienced what you are explaining. Definately sounds bad. Sorry.

[hoax]

She is just kinda stumbling around (like she is drunk)

This so friggen sucks!!!!

[Mike Cavanaugh]

The problem with ASF's is that in most places there aren't a lot around. Because of this, many are just one line that are inbreeded over and over again for years. The result is smaller then usual rats with colony specific health problems that develop over time.

This is why when I first started I traveled all over getting 4 unrelated lines. while my colony's babies are now mostly from various crosses between the lines, I still have breeding groups that are selectively bred 100% from the origional lines.

The male being so small leads me to believe that this may be the problem.

That said, it could also be the ages of your group. Many breeders when selling ASF's sell groups of different ages... Or they sell what are basicly X-breeders knowing that you want to breed yourself. IMHO, this is shady business practices at best. Often they sell females that have already had many litters and are already at the end of their reproductive life. This may also be why the male is smaller. You may have been sold 2 females at the end of their reproductive life and a younger male.

Sure it could be something wrong with husbandry, or just some kind of normal sickness... but that doesn't add up with a male smaller then the females.

Any time you buy a group for breeding, and don't know a whole lot about the breeder, you should just buy them at the just weined size... and wait the couple months for the first litter. Then you know what you are working with. When I sell breeding groups the girls are virgins.

Mike

[hoax]

I have the female quarantined

She looks like she might be doing a little better she is not panting as hard and she is staying on all fours...

I really don't know what is going on.

I am setting up a separate tank to keep her in for a few days. I hope that she gets back to health and if she is sick then I really do not want my other two to get it.

I have offered her a little food and I will put some water in a shallow dish until i get her tank fully set up. I have to go into town and get some more supplies.

[Mike Cavanaugh]

Just be careful. when you reintroduce her, there may be trouble.

Mike

[hoax]

OK things are starting to look better.

She doesn't seem lethargic any more.

She is still kinda stumbling around. I took about 40 pictures trying to get a good example to show. I could not get anything that does not seem normal in a still frame.

I figured it out though. You can go look at Connie's video of her ASF's that are walking strange. My one female is doing the same thing just much less coordinated. It looks very upsetting.

Her legs stretch straight out to the sides and she rolls over every now and then. She is also licking herself alot she is cleaning her feet and her "girl bits"

Her mammeries seem like she has been breed before... I was not told she had never been breed but that was what I thought I was getting.

So for all you first time buyers out there don't be afraid to ask questions. I have not yet contacted the person I bought my ASF's from to ask them these same questions. So it would be unfair to make any allegations of improper behavior on their part. They seemed like good people a nice home and respectable jobs. I do not think they would have tried to shiest me on purpose.

[Mike Cavanaugh]

So for all you first time buyers out there don't be afraid to ask questions. I have not yet contacted the person I bought my ASF's from to ask them these same questions. So it would be unfair to make any allegations of improper behavior on their part. They seemed like good people a nice home and respectable jobs. I do not think they would have tried to shiest me on purpose.

Please do not misunderstand me. I am not accusing the person who sold these rats to you of "shiesting" you. That would be totally unfair to the seller who may be completely innocent!

All I am doing is providing possible answers to your questions... I am giving you good questions to ask. I would certainly contact the seller, and ask a bunch of questions. If anyone ever experienced anything with my rats and did not contact me about it, I would not be able to fix it!!!!

Hoping Connie will chime in because as you stated she has had experience with this kind of thing... But IMHO I would not even consider continuing trying to breed her. I would feed her off and get new breeders.

Mike

[hoax]

Please do not misunderstand me. I am not accusing the person who sold these rats to you of "shiesting" you. That would be totally unfair to the seller who may be completely innocent!

All I am doing is providing possible answers to your questions... I am giving you good questions to ask. I would certainly contact the seller, and ask a bunch of questions. If anyone ever experienced anything with my rats and did not contact me about it, I would not be able to fix it!!!!

Hoping Connie will chime in because as you stated she has had experience with this kind of thing... But IMHO I would not even consider continuing trying to breed her. I would feed her off and get new breeders.

Mike

Thank you for your reply.

I really should contact the breeder I am just so mad that I have to go through this...

I am really upset that my breeder got sick...

I do not have the BP to try to feed her too so I would not try to feed her off. fedding off sick animals does not make sense. why would i feed off a sick animal.

My main goal was to try to get my colony going so I could have plenty to feed. with out going to the pet store to buy feeders....

I will explain more tomorrow when I can...

[littleindiangirl]

I'm sorry this is happening, I too have no idea as to what it could be if it were viral or bacterial sickness.

One group of my ASF's have a genetic disease, I consider it to be a muscular and nervous disorder, simple recessive as well. The video shows some young ones that don't necessarily have the disease badly, it can rear its ugly head much worse.

If she improves over today, or not, let us know. I would advise finding another source regardless. If she has the genetic disease, no point in using her. We do not want to propagate this disease.