Trans-pecos or Bairds activity during the day?

[Caitlin]

I'm trying to help a friend identify what snake might be a good pet. At this point she's very interested in a Corn, Trans-pecos, Baird's, or a Children's python. She would like a snake that is at least somewhat active during the day. I've never kept a suboc (though it is surely tempting) and I know they are mainly nocturnal but may be visible on their branches during the day.

I think a snake that's active from sunset onward would be fine; she is just trying to avoid species that are deeply nocturnal.

Some of my supposedly nocturnal snakes have definitely adjusted their activity schedules in captivity to at least somewhat parallel the times when I'm active, so I wasn't sure if the rat snakes did this as well?

I'm looking forward to replies from Bogertophis <3 and others who have experience with these beauties.

[Bogertophis]

Those are all great choices for pet snakes, & of the 4 species in question, I'd recommend a Baird's or Corn snake for being more active by day, & both are docile. Baird's rat snakes typically get longer than corn snakes, if that's an issue.

My Trans Pecos ("subocs") tend to sleep in their hides by day & get active in the evening hours; if you provide them baskets wired into their branches, they may sleep there also, especially if you include some mild overhead warmth. If you want to see more of them during the day, remember that they don't like bright light- they have huge eyes well-suited for night vision. Every one I've known has been docile by nature, & they tend to move slowly when handled.

I don't have a Children's python, but only a very similar (slightly larger) Aussie Spotted python. She too is nocturnal, but she often sleeps on her branches/driftwood (w/ heat overhead), & while Trans Pecos aren't typically "cranky" about being awakened by day (they're usually curious), my spotted python changes gears the best, perhaps because she is the nosiest or the most prey-driven. She tends to pop her head up if there's any action nearby no matter what time of day- even when she's in her humid hide. Of course, she's probably hoping for prey, not inedible hands, but I don't have a problem with her biting me by mistake- I just make a point of identifying myself, as with all my snakes.

[Zincubus]

From my experience Trans-Pecos whilst being uber docile were rather nervous and nocturnal.. I rarely saw the little blighter


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[Bogertophis]

From my experience Trans-Pecos whilst being uber docile were rather nervous and nocturnal.. I rarely saw the little blighter


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That's typical only of a young hatchling- look how small they are. It takes time for tiny colubrid snakes to grow. How long ago did you have this snake? Because I'm thinking it may also have been a wild-caught. And if it came from a pet-store, may have been shipped, also.

My first TP was an apparent w/c adult from a pet store, many years ago. To make matters worse, the idiotic store employees had been teasing that snake to make her hiss & strike defensively. Happily that store went out of business- they were known for selling w/c imports with mites & all sorts of issues. I was still fairly new to snakes at that time but I couldn't leave her there- she came home with me.

She stunk badly from her own musk & the filthy cage they had her in. I felt so sorry for her, there was no leaving her there, & after a while with me in an ideal set-up (40 gal breeder tank with heat & hides, etc) she was a calm & happy camper. Initially got her eating by offering her live fuzzy mice- no apologies- & it was interesting because you could almost see a smile on her face. Not only that, but she would eat them calmly out of my hand, as long as I held them one at a time between my fingers so the mouse protruded & she could easily take it without biting me. If the fuzzy was on my flat palm, she didn't take it- you could see that she wanted it, but it was almost as if she was trying to avoid biting me. I loved that snake for many years, & had no trouble getting her on pre-killed mice & baby rats thereafter. These are seemingly smart & naturally calm sweet snakes when provided the right environment. Patience & empathy goes a long way with snakes.

I went on to breed Trans Pecos (how I avoided keeping them all is beyond me?), & also I later got a pair of c/b hatchlings from a great source. Before they arrived (air shipped) I knew they'd be quite stressed & they were also shipped right out of the egg per my agreement with the seller (it was either that or wait until spring, as these are usually hatched in late fall, & the source lives in Maine). So I did something I've never done for hatchlings before or since- I used some light cardboard box lids to construct rather elaborate (though small) maze-hides for each one (separately housed, of course). They took to them right away & throughout the days I'd see them peeking out of the various little doors- cutest darn things! Pretty soon, they were in & out, exploring happily & feeling safe, knowing they could easily return to their shelters. In the wild, these prefer sheltering in & around rocks & such.

It was sad when they out-grew those hides, & being cardboard anyway, it was also a matter of cleanliness too. But they served their purpose- those little snakes ate soon after arrival because they felt safe & warm. Never had a bit of trouble feeding them. Again, they didn't stay in those hides, but made regular excursions to explore their tanks- without me handling them for quite a while btw. (Yes, glass tanks- I'm not a fan of "tubs" & "shoeboxes", & being desert snakes, these REQUIRE good air-flow for health reasons.) Their natural curiosity took over- while at first I fed them on top of their hides (within reach of a doorway) it didn't take long for them to completely come out for meals. You might have to make a little effort to befriend a shy nocturnal Trans Pecos, especially a hatchling, but with the right mindset, I think you'll find them worthwhile. As always though, we don't all love the same things. And with all tiny colubrids, watch but don't handle them for a while, until they're feeding regularly & gain a bit of size.

The two I still have are both up in years now- one is the 14-year old male c/b of that "just out of the egg" het pair I've been describing, & he's about 5' long. The other is an unrelated 'normal' male I obtained from another source as a yearling- he's now 15. (I prefer their natural markings to the blond & silver versions, of which that pair is/was het for.) Sadly the female het passed last year of a medical issue that my vet was unable to help with.

[Zincubus]

That's typical only of a young hatchling- look how small they are. It takes time for tiny colubrid snakes to grow. How long ago did you have this snake? Because I'm thinking it may also have been a wild-caught. And if it came from a pet-store, may have been shipped, also.

My first TP was an apparent w/c adult from a pet store, many years ago. To make matters worse, the idiotic store employees had been teasing that snake to make her hiss & strike defensively. Happily that store went out of business- they were known for selling w/c imports with mites & all sorts of issues. I was still fairly new to snakes at that time but I couldn't leave her there- she came home with me.

She stunk badly from her own musk & the filthy cage they had her in. I felt so sorry for her, there was no leaving her there, & after a while with me in an ideal set-up (40 gal breeder tank with heat & hides, etc) she was a calm & happy camper. Initially got her eating by offering her live fuzzy mice- no apologies- & it was interesting because you could almost see a smile on her face. Not only that, but she would eat them calmly out of my hand, as long as I held them one at a time between my fingers so the mouse protruded & she could easily take it without biting me. If the fuzzy was on my flat palm, she didn't take it- you could see that she wanted it, but it was almost as if she was trying to avoid biting me. I loved that snake for many years, & had no trouble getting her on pre-killed mice & baby rats thereafter. These are seemingly smart & naturally calm sweet snakes when provided the right environment. Patience & empathy goes a long way with snakes.

I went on to breed Trans Pecos (how I avoided keeping them all is beyond me?), & also I later got a pair of c/b hatchlings from a great source. Before they arrived (air shipped) I knew they'd be quite stressed & they were also shipped right out of the egg per my agreement with the seller (it was either that or wait until spring, as these are usually hatched in late fall, & the source lives in Maine). So I did something I've never done for hatchlings before or since- I used some light cardboard box lids to construct rather elaborate (though small) maze-hides for each one (separately housed, of course). They took to them right away & throughout the days I'd see them peeking out of the various little doors- cutest darn things! Pretty soon, they were in & out, exploring happily & feeling safe, knowing they could easily return to their shelters. In the wild, these prefer sheltering in & around rocks & such.

It was sad when they out-grew those hides, & being cardboard anyway, it was also a matter of cleanliness too. But they served their purpose- those little snakes ate soon after arrival because they felt safe & warm. Never had a bit of trouble feeding them. Again, they didn't stay in those hides, but made regular excursions to explore their tanks- without me handling them for quite a while btw. (Yes, glass tanks- I'm not a fan of "tubs" & "shoeboxes", & being desert snakes, these REQUIRE good air-flow for health reasons.) Their natural curiosity took over- while at first I fed them on top of their hides (within reach of a doorway) it didn't take long for them to completely come out for meals. You might have to make a little effort to befriend a shy nocturnal Trans Pecos, especially a hatchling, but with the right mindset, I think you'll find them worthwhile. As always though, we don't all love the same things. And with all tiny colubrids, watch but don't handle them for a while, until they're feeding regularly & gain a bit of size.

The two I still have are both up in years now- one is the 14-year old male c/b of that "just out of the egg" het pair I've been describing, & he's about 5' long. The other is an unrelated 'normal' male I obtained from another source as a yearling- he's now 15. (I prefer their natural markings to the blond & silver versions, of which that pair is/was het for.) Sadly the female het passed last year of a medical issue that my vet was unable to help with.

Yes is was a youngster-about 6 months old — a fellow forum member was desperate to have one so I felt that he would appreciate it more than I was and I sold it after about 3 months


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[dakski]

I really like Trans-Pecos, although I do not have one. I do have two corn snakes and love them. I've also heard good things about Baird's.

My two cents, if it's her first snake, or she wants something easy to care for, you cannot go wrong with a corn snake. Great personality, docile, great eaters, easy requirements (she can get a cheap glass tank - as long as it's escape proof).

They come in every color and pattern you can imagine. They are inexpensive.

The only drawback of any smaller colubrid, is that they are really small when very young. I would recommend she get a yearling +/- so it's not incredibly tiny and fragile.

Children's pythons have stricter requirements than all others listed, but aren't always as docile.

Regarding being active during the day. Corn snakes are active in the evening and early morning. I see them out and about in the evening hoping for food.

I googled diurnal snakes and this came up. Probably worth looking at.

https://thereptileroom.net/snakes-th...uring-the-day/

[Bogertophis]

I would agree that of the 4 species being discussed, a children's python is most likely to be not-so-docile- and especially for a first snake, corn & rat snakes are better choices for ease of care too. That's very good advice, about starting off with a healthy yearling, if one can be obtained.

I looked at that link, & they list good choices for diurnal snakes- including gopher & "rat snakes" (in general- they didn't get specific). The thing to remember is that every species has pros & cons- and sometimes the best care & best results are achieved when a person picks what most appeals to them. (Gopher & bull snakes need large cages & are very active- some can be feisty too, or at least the ones I've known were expert at bluffing. My bull snake hatchlings were not, however, "bluffing"- They were quite sassy!)

As far as snake activity, the most active diurnal snake I can think of is a racer, such as a coachwhip- but for most people, they make terrible pets, lol. Very active & hard to handle without bites. Garter snakes are entertaining too, but not so much fun to "handle".

Remember too that most snakes are not "out in the open" all that much except when they're hungry, no matter what their "normal hours of operation" happen to be. Snakes are pets whose privacy needs should be expected AND respected- they'll never be a "constant companion" like dogs & cats, but they're still rewarding in their own way. They provide a window into nature.

[Homebody]

I'm looking forward to replies from Bogertophis <3 and others who have experience with these beauties.

My Children's python is active from dinnertime (~6:30 PM) to when I put him back in his enclosure at bedtime (~11:00 PM). Works perfect for me because that's when I'm most available to interact with him. He sometimes comes out of his enclosure in the mornings, as well.

I've taken my fair share of bites. None of them hurt. Almost all of them were a result of his mistaking my fingers for food. I think the Children's python is the smallest of the species your friend is considering. It makes them comparatively inexpensive to house and easy to clean up after.

[paulh]

I googled diurnal snakes and this came up. Probably worth looking at.

https://thereptileroom.net/snakes-th...uring-the-day/

I have kept 8 of the 10 USA native snakes on that list (all but the indigo and green). And I have captive bred 3 of the 8. IMO the corn snake ranks right at the top of the list. The others rank second or lower due to size, docility or other factor.

[Bogertophis]

For what it's worth, I've kept various #'s of 6 of the USA native snakes on that list, & bred 4 "kinds" of them -& that's IF you count all the various kinds of USA rat snakes as "one"- They're similar but sure not the same.