Mice and Their Parental Habits

[IamKaervek]

I've recently become the owner of 4 proud mice parents, and have some questions regarding the ways in which mice care for their young. Perhaps this isn't the best forum to discuss this (maybe a more rodent-centered forum would be better), but I figured I'd give it a shot anyway.

About an hour ago, I moved two of my mice and their pinkies to a new, cleaned enclosure (as per the countless advice I've received from various sites) on their 3rd day of life. I've noticed now, that the pinkies are being slightly scattered around and away from the group that they were usually in. The majority of the pinkines remain in their group, but 2 or 3 of them have either moved, or have been moved by their parents a few inches away individually. I'm wondering if this is directly related to them having been interacted with by myself, or if this is normal after a few days from being born. It almost seems as if these few mice are being singled-out as if they're going to be shunned by the parents. So far, not hostile action has been witnessed. The mother and father are constantly roaming around the cage kicking substrate around as if to be buidling a new nest, but there doesn't seem to be any rhyme or reason to it, and the father actually did it once in the pile of babies, kicking one of them a few inches away - do you think he did this on purpose, or accident?

If anybody knows of a nice rodent-based forum that I should take this question to, I'd appreciate a link Thanks in advance.

[Jeanne]

There really is no way to tell what MICE are thinking or why for sure they do certain things. I will however say this, when I was breeding mice, because they do seem to eat thier babies alot more than rats, I did not change thier bedding immediately, I waited at least a week, but if I HAD to change thier bedding and fuss with them, I would scoop out the WHOLE nest, with old bedding and babies, and place it right into a corner of the clean enclosure. You really want to limit fussing with them as little as possible IMO for the first few weeks. I also noticed, when I was breeding them, sometimes they will tend to do what looks to be singling out certain babies, but if the litter is HUGE, the female may not be able to care for all at once and needs to separate them into smaller groups for thier care. Also, it could actually be that they are singling out certain babies, this is natures way for getting rid of the weak. The fittest survive, and this behavior ensures that. Also, did you know that most likely, your female is actually pregnant again? Rodents can become pregnant almost immediately after giving birth, from my experience, I have seen this to lead to Mom putting out babies to make her litters smaller, cause she knows she must get them weaned and on thier own food intake before her new litter is due to be born. It is best to separate your male and female so immediate pregnancy does not happen so soon after birth.

[IamKaervek]

Well, it seems that after getting settled into their new home, she's back to nursing for her entire litter, and nobody is being left out. In hindsight, switching enclosures altogether was probably too risky, and simply removing the parents while changing the substrate surrounding the pups' nest would have been the safest bet. Something I won't do again until the pups are weened, but I'm glad that she's back to nurturing for all of her babies again.

[daniel1983]

If you ever have to move around 1-5 day old mice, I have found that it helps if rub some used mouse bedding from that enclosure in your hands before you pick anything up. Kinda gets rid of that 'human' smell and will prevent the mama from eating or abandoning a baby because they don't smell right.

With moving around babies and housing with males, you also want to make sure not to have another male mouses smell on your hands or seperate the babies and the father for too long. Male mice will kill the babies if they think that the babies are not theirs.

Mother mice do not seem to be all that picky with their babies. I have mixed up litters before and had no problems. They generally like to have their own nest instead of sharing one. If you have two females with young in the same enclosure, you may see them 'stealing' each others young.....this is fine and is actually funny to watch.

Mice are very interesting critters and are fun to watch sometimes. Hope that little bit of info that I have picked up along the way helps.....if not I have alot more

[recycling goddess]

it's a really good idea to not remove or disturb the nest until the pups are weaned. whenever i had a mom who was getting ready to burst... i would clean the cage, and then, just leave it alone. IF i needed to clean the cage... i would clean everything but the nest... i wouldn't move it, just clean around it.

the male should, of course, be removed before she births as she can become pregnant immediately after giving birth and that's not good for her health.

here's a link for you with some great info.

http://www.horns.freeserve.co.uk/mouse.htm

[IamKaervek]

Thanks for the link.

It's really hard to decide just which information is good information. I've read so many things about breeding mice, that it's really difficult to tell whose information you should accept. On some sites, people say that removing the male isn't necessary, and that leaving him in is beneficial. Other sites say it's only necessary if you're not wanting more mice. Moving the mice on the 3rd day or later is perfect for cleaning the cage. Don't move the mice until they're weened. Etc., etc.

Trial and error, I suppose, along with learning from other peoples' experience...

[daniel1983]

That site is a good site to get info from.....that is one that I got some initial information when I started breeding mice.

Concerning the male mice left in with babies.....I have done both....no problems either way...just be careful of what I mentioned earlier. The only thing that I have noticed is that having a male in stresses the mother more (cause once she has the babies he is constantly trying to breed again). I generally take the males out because with my female breeders I like to give them a few weeks to regain their strength after having the babies. This will allow your mice to be healthier and have consistantly larger litters.

With moving baby mice...IMO....it seems to be dependant on two things: how comfortable the females are with you and what your hands smell like. If you were always handling your mice before they had babies, they don't really seem to worry about you hurting them as much. If you just keep them and only handle on cleaning days, then I would be a bit more worried about moving. But once the babies have hair.....I always move them around with no problems.

Mice are like any other animal....each one is different....I am always learning from my mice.