Rough scales coming off like a human scab

[bcr229]

I've seen the "thin skin" issue in a snake I've rescued in the past due to chronic malnourishment. When a snake is in this condition, they may always have easily torn skin from then on, even after their nutrition has improved; they become "special needs" pets even after their skin heals over. When a snake is starving, the skin is not as important to survival as their main bodily organs, so what nourishment there is never reaches the skin- sadly the damage can be permanent.

The name for the condition is slipped skin disease. It's been seen here before.

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/show...les-Just-Split

The snake needs to be in a minimal setup - smooth plastic hides, paper substrate, water bowl. Nothing rough that can snag the skin and pull it off.

[Bogertophis]

Yes to all that ^ ^ ^ plus very careful, gentle handling from now on.

[xAnthemia]

I've read over the SSD PDF; I'm not a scientific writer so I'm not understanding the more complicated aspects. Out of curiosity, how well studied do you think the disease is? Do we know what the starting signs are? Do different species have different starting signs? I know in the PDF both instances of the condition occur in Carpet/Diamond Pythons, which are closely related (carpet and diamond pythons closely related). Is there any scientific documentation on the disease occurring in other species? Sorry if I'm asking way too many questions here.

Thank you for the links. Praying that when I get to the vet it turns out to be something other than slippery skin disease; hoping whatever the issue is its minor at the very very best but even if worse comes to worse I'm at least praying for a disease that is more studied

[Jolty]

Keeping in mind that I am very new to snakes, I have a theory that this is hypervitaminosis c (scurvy) from prey that is also malnourished. What are you feeding? Whole rodents, and not pinkies, right? Are you feeding f/t or live at the moment? If you're buying frozen, I'd personally suggest sourcing your prey from somewhere else -- again, more experienced members can correct me if I'm wrong -- but I'd think low quality prey would be the most likely cause.

I hope you get them feeling better soon.

[Bogertophis]

Keeping in mind that I am very new to snakes, I have a theory that this is hypervitaminosis c (scurvy) from prey that is also malnourished. What are you feeding? Whole rodents, and not pinkies, right? Are you feeding f/t or live at the moment? If you're buying frozen, I'd personally suggest sourcing your prey from somewhere else -- again, more experienced members can correct me if I'm wrong -- but I'd think low quality prey would be the most likely cause.

I hope you get them feeling better soon.

You're entitled to your theory- however, if you carefully read the OP's first post, it's the SNAKE that's been malnourished, and also, we've seen this before in other chronically-starved snakes- see post #11 above. (We are definitely not new to snakes.)

Also, "hypervitaminosis" refers to EXCESSIVE vitamins- that's NOT what scurvy is, it's a lack of vitamin C (in humans, not snakes)... so the term you were trying for was "hypovitaminosis" (hypo= too little). It's still not the issue though.

[Armiyana]

I have a theory

From the post bcr229 linked to, Skin Slipping Disease is something that's been noted in Carpet and Diamond pythons. For those particular species, it looks to be a genetic predisposition towards some sort of vitamin deficiency. Something about those snakes just isn't quite clicking right. Maybe an unidentified autoimmune condition or genetic mutation.

In Bogertophis and I's case, we have both personally worked with severely malnourished animals who developed similar conditions. Mine was a ball python hatchling at a big box shop that went off food for 2 months while I was on disability. Apparently it had arrived from the breeder as a small thin little guy and the vet that saw it sadly wasn't as knowledgeable as I hoped. So I couldn't do much when I got back and saw the little one.

Interestingly enough, when I had worked more with dogs, I would work with toy breed dogs that had bouts hypoglycemia (low blood sugar). It wasn't a thing that happens often (typically in the most severe cases) but about a week or two after recovering some of these puppies would just loose all of their hair. Completely bald. It would eventually grow back just fine, just took time. But again, skin reacting to that lack of nutrient.


You are right to an extent. Vitamin deficiencies or overdoses (and other problems like parasites) can definitely be caused by what we feed, we do need to make sure we are using properly raised/grown food items and the right supplements for the species that need it. I've seen some gnarly looking feeders at local pet stores that I've turned away before. I buy 97% of my feeders frozen from a reputable company because of it. But I don't think that is the problem for this little one based on OP's mention of malnourishment in the first post.

[xAnthemia]

As an update for this post, I can get to the Vets at Monday, 11am, in Chorley. Was hoping Saturday but can't do that. In the mean time, going to be using paper towel as bedding. Does anyone have any suggestions regarding humidity and paper towel, as my vivarium is notorious for humidity issues; it's why I have a truck of sphagnum moss and have to mist every day to maintain a constant 50-70% humidity (avg. humidity being 60%). Something tells me that removing all that moss and coconut husk will worsen humidity.

[bcr229]

Spaghnum moss and coco husk are pretty soft so they won't rip the skin as your snake moves around, but they are hard to keep super clean so your snake's skin doesn't pick up an infection. The moss can be disinfected before use by boiling it (according to web sites where it's used for gardening) so maybe just have a large humid hide with only moss. I would be worried about bits of coco getting under the snake's skin.

[Homebody]

Does anyone have any suggestions regarding humidity and paper towel, as my vivarium is notorious for humidity issues; it's why I have a truck of sphagnum moss and have to mist every day to maintain a constant 50-70% humidity (avg. humidity being 60%). Something tells me that removing all that moss and coconut husk will worsen humidity.

You could make a humid hide by sealing a sponge to the bottom of a plastic bowl, cutting a door out of the rim and turning it over. You'll need give the sealant time to finish off-gassing before you use it though.

[Bogertophis]

...
In Bogertophis and I's case, we have both personally worked with severely malnourished animals who developed similar conditions. Mine was a ball python hatchling at a big box shop that went off food for 2 months while I was on disability. Apparently it had arrived from the breeder as a small thin little guy and the vet that saw it sadly wasn't as knowledgeable as I hoped. So I couldn't do much when I got back and saw the little one...

And fyi, the one I worked on was a 5' & otherwise beautiful Argentine boa that had apparently been chronically deprived of adequate nutrition. Plus, I've seen a few similar cases reported & well-documented elsewhere in recent years. In the interest of keeping an open mind though, that boa was dumped on me in that condition- so I cannot verify that she actually wasn't fed enough- I suppose the problem might also have been caused by some sort of malabsorption of nutrients or other internal issues, rather than insufficient food provided- but that was a reasonable assumption when you saw the home she came from. I was busy trying to heal the many holes she had in her skin while she was under my care.