Frontline spray for mites

[jeff68982]

I am going to use front line spray for a mite problem I have. NO idea where they came from only thing I done different was get my rats from another source. I been treating with reptile spray but having no luck with that.
I watched and read the videos on using the front line. It just shows to wipe down the snake with it. Do I not need to spray down the rack or tubs as well?

[Bogertophis]

Your rats (live, I assume?) probably had mites- but are you sure they're snake mites? Are they ON the snake? Snake mites are different from rodent mites.

I've never used Frontline for snakes, & never would (there are safer alternatives), but some have & do. Here's a long previous post explaining most options:

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/show...=1#post2708936

Personally, I'd go for some soaks w/ a drop of mild soap, to drown as many mites as possible, then use Natural Chemistry. Stronger chemicals like Frontline, & PAM (Provent-A-Mite) can have side effects, even fatal ones, if your snake is sensitive or you aren't careful about directions.

Mites can hide or leave eggs in all sorts of substrates & natural materials (wood) used as furnishings- so all that stuff should be discarded, far from where the snake is kept & a.s.a.p. And don't think you're rid of snake mites until you're well-past a month of being mite-free- they're famous for making a next-generation reappearance.

[jeff68982]

They are crawling on the snakes and tubs. I soaked them in water with dawn to get hem off of them. Sprayed the tubs and racks with reptile spray. Done this 3 times in a week and checked the morning and they have them again. People I seen swear by front line. I guess everyone has different methods that work. I was just confused if you only treat the snake with front line it doesn't seem like it does anything with the mites that may be on the rack itself.

Your rats (live, I assume?) probably had mites- but are you sure they're snake mites? Are they ON the snake? Snake mites are different from rodent mites.

I've never used Frontline for snakes, & never would (there are safer alternatives), but some have & do. Here's a long previous post explaining most options:

https://ball-pythons.net/forums/show...=1#post2708936

[Bogertophis]

Sounds awful! I haven't had to deal with mites in many years, & then only on 2 newly acquired snakes, & the mites went no further. (I had a house-FULL of snakes at the time- but there's an advantage to not housing snakes so close together in racks. ) Anyway, good luck. I know some here have used Frontline with good effects- but can't promise they'll see & respond to your post quickly enough.

In the link I gave you, there IS a link within at the top for using FRONTLINE- it may answer your question?

[Caitlin]

I personally wouldn't use Frontline but I know others do. I prefer PAM (Provent a Mite). Since Natural Chemistry was also mentioned, I just wanted to remind any newer keepers that any substance - 'natural' or not - that is capable of killing mites is also capable of killing your snake or causing neurological damage if not used correctly. In a keepers group I admin, we had an instance just last month of a young snake having seizures after the keeper used Natural Chemistry on it. It turns out he was spraying most of the damned bottle on the poor animal.

You have to use some pretty nasty stuff to successfully eradicate a mite infestation - there's no getting around it. So just please please be very careful, don't put mite products directly on very small, very young, or debilitated snakes, don't overuse the product, and when used on enclosures be absolutely certain it has dried completely before putting the snake back in.

I wish the predatory Taurrus mites were available in the U.S. for eradicating snake mites but for some reason we can't get them here. I know there are other predatory mites folks have tried but from the reports I've gotten they aren't as effective as the Taurrus mites.

[Bogertophis]

I absolutely agree that "natural" is a much-over-used word that means very little, other than to make us trust & buy a product. I've never actually tried Natural Chemistry for mites- like most of these products, it wasn't around the last time I had mites (though I noticed there were a few dinosaurs roaming at the time- ). I only said I "would" try it, since I understand how it works & I've had good results from other products they make. Thank you, Caitlin, for reminding everyone to be cautious & follow directions, & that most anything can be way over-done, causing harm.
Especially with snakes, as they're so stoic.

[bcr229]

Treating mites: I wrote this up after my second battle with the little so-and-so's. While other treatments, such as ivermectin injections and wiping the snakes with Frontline, do exist, I have not tried them so I've not included them in my own writeup. You can find out about Frontline at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BwCA...&feature=share


Mite Eradication 101:


*** Permethrin ***


Permethrin comes in many forms - Provent-A-Mite (PAM), NIX/RID head lice treatment, Permethrin-10 from a livestock supply store, etc. Once mixed with water its half life is 30 days if kept out of direct sunlight.


PAM has several advantages. It has been tested for use with reptiles, and it comes ready to use. The disadvantages are that it's expensive and most reptile stores don't have it in stock, so you have to wait for it to be shipped to you if you don't have any on hand. Meanwhile the mites are busy feeding and breeding.


NIX/RID is cheaper than PAM and is readily available at WalMart, CVS, and other drug stores. It is also easy to dilute: mix one two ounce (59 ml) bottle of the cream rinse with one gallon of water.


Permethrin-10 is the cheapest of the three options; one eight ounce bottle will make 240 gallons of solution, as only 6 milliliters of it are needed per gallon of water to make an effective mite spray. The upside is that if you have a lot of snakes to treat this will do it very economically. The downside is that it's all too easy to make too strong of a permethrin solution which can seriously injure or kill your snakes.


No matter which product you use, it must be used correctly. I've never applied any permethrin product directly onto my snakes as it's not needed for mite treatment, and permethrin poisoning in a snake can cause irreversible neurological damage or death.


Permethrin use: spray the enclosure, paper substrate, and hides with the diluted solution or PAM. DO NOT SPRAY THE WATER BOWL. Allow everything to dry completely before returning your snake to its home. Also keep a supply of treated and dried newspaper or paper towels and treated hides available so that when a snake makes a mess, you replace the soiled paper and hides with treated ones. Treat the enclosure every two to three weeks.


*** Natural Chemistry Reptile Spray ***


Reptile Spray kills mites on contact while wet, once it dries it loses its effectiveness pretty quickly. Reptile Spray is a solution of salts rather than an insecticide; it kills mites by dehydrating them. I don't spray the snakes as more ends up on the floor than on the snake. Instead, I spray a white paper towel with it and wipe it on the snake. That way you get even coverage on the snake, you can work it into the area under their chin really well as that's a favorite hiding place for mites, you don't stress out your snake, and you can look for mites on the paper towel to see how quickly they're being eradicated. Apply twice a week. Note - this stuff hurts like hell in an open wound.


*** Hot Shot No-Pest Strips ***


Some people take a Hot Shot No-Pest strip, cut it into pieces, put each piece into a small sealed container, poke some holes in the container, and put each container into the snake's enclosure. I've used the No-Pest strip but I just hang it in the snake room and close the door. Either way is effective, especially if you have a major outbreak.


If you do use it, remove the water bowls as the insecticide is strongly attracted to water and you don't want the snake drinking it. After 24 hours remove the strip (or pieces), put them into an airtight container for future use, air out the room, and put the water bowls back. Repeat treatment weekly.


Important! If you also keep tarantulas, feeder roaches/dubias, crickets, etc. do not use the No-Pest Strip as it can kill them too!!!!


*** Mild Dish Soap ***


One or two drops of mild dish detergent in your snake's bath water will break the surface tension and prevent mites from floating in the water so they drown. No more than that is needed, your snake should not look like it is taking a bubble bath.


*** Heat ***


Don't laugh, but a temperature of 135*F for five seconds will kill mites and the eggs. I purchased a heat gun used for stripping paint that can be set to blow hot air from 180*F through 1200*F. Using the heat gun and a temperature gun I heated the surfaces and crevices of my racks and enclosures to kill off any mite eggs that may have been laid outside the tubs. Don't get your enclosure surfaces and joined/glued areas too hot or you can damage them.


Mite treatment should continue for 30 days after you stop finding mites on your snake, as an egg can take that long to hatch.


*** FINAL NOTES ***


Effective quarantine means that you treat every new arrival as if it has mites, and new snakes are kept as far away from your established collection as possible for at least 90 days. At the very least new critters should never be in the same room with your established collection.


I treat the quarantine enclosure, hides, and paper substrate with permethrin a day or so before the new snake arrives, and I wipe the snake with a paper towel soaked in Reptile Spray as part of my inspection process when it comes out of the shipping box. If the snake has mites I will know it within a day or two at most. This also goes for snakes from "trusted" sources, my first mite outbreak ever came from someone I trusted.


Finally, a mite egg can take up to 30 days to hatch. So, suppose you treat for a week or so and you think the mites are gone... but there are some eggs left. You stop treating. The eggs hatch a few weeks later, the mites grow up, and the females lay eggs. After six to eight weeks those eggs are hatching and you notice a full-blown infestation. So, if you think you "keep getting mites", you're not: you failed to eradicate the original infestation. Mite treatments should continue for 30 days after you stop finding them.

[Bogertophis]

I have to say, this is one area that I'm GLAD I'm not an expert in. Mites are miserable, especially if they've spread to a large collection of snakes. And they seem to be much more common in recent years, probably thanks to expos, more sales (increasing popularity of keeping snakes) & that elusive "trust" factor. It's like trying to track down who shared their cold with you.

[jeff68982]

Does the rack itself need to be sprayed with pam or just the tubs?

Treating mites: I wrote this up after my second battle with the little so-and-so's. While other treatments, such as ivermectin injections and wiping the snakes with Frontline, do exist, I have not tried them so I've not included them in my own writeup. You can find out about Frontline at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BwCA...&feature=share


Mite Eradication 101:


*** Permethrin ***


Permethrin comes in many forms - Provent-A-Mite (PAM), NIX/RID head lice treatment, Permethrin-10 from a livestock supply store, etc. Once mixed with water its half life is 30 days if kept out of direct sunlight.


PAM has several advantages. It has been tested for use with reptiles, and it comes ready to use. The disadvantages are that it's expensive and most reptile stores don't have it in stock, so you have to wait for it to be shipped to you if you don't have any on hand. Meanwhile the mites are busy feeding and breeding.


NIX/RID is cheaper than PAM and is readily available at WalMart, CVS, and other drug stores. It is also easy to dilute: mix one two ounce (59 ml) bottle of the cream rinse with one gallon of water.


Permethrin-10 is the cheapest of the three options; one eight ounce bottle will make 240 gallons of solution, as only 6 milliliters of it are needed per gallon of water to make an effective mite spray. The upside is that if you have a lot of snakes to treat this will do it very economically. The downside is that it's all too easy to make too strong of a permethrin solution which can seriously injure or kill your snakes.


No matter which product you use, it must be used correctly. I've never applied any permethrin product directly onto my snakes as it's not needed for mite treatment, and permethrin poisoning in a snake can cause irreversible neurological damage or death.


Permethrin use: spray the enclosure, paper substrate, and hides with the diluted solution or PAM. DO NOT SPRAY THE WATER BOWL. Allow everything to dry completely before returning your snake to its home. Also keep a supply of treated and dried newspaper or paper towels and treated hides available so that when a snake makes a mess, you replace the soiled paper and hides with treated ones. Treat the enclosure every two to three weeks.


*** Natural Chemistry Reptile Spray ***


Reptile Spray kills mites on contact while wet, once it dries it loses its effectiveness pretty quickly. Reptile Spray is a solution of salts rather than an insecticide; it kills mites by dehydrating them. I don't spray the snakes as more ends up on the floor than on the snake. Instead, I spray a white paper towel with it and wipe it on the snake. That way you get even coverage on the snake, you can work it into the area under their chin really well as that's a favorite hiding place for mites, you don't stress out your snake, and you can look for mites on the paper towel to see how quickly they're being eradicated. Apply twice a week. Note - this stuff hurts like hell in an open wound.


*** Hot Shot No-Pest Strips ***


Some people take a Hot Shot No-Pest strip, cut it into pieces, put each piece into a small sealed container, poke some holes in the container, and put each container into the snake's enclosure. I've used the No-Pest strip but I just hang it in the snake room and close the door. Either way is effective, especially if you have a major outbreak.


If you do use it, remove the water bowls as the insecticide is strongly attracted to water and you don't want the snake drinking it. After 24 hours remove the strip (or pieces), put them into an airtight container for future use, air out the room, and put the water bowls back. Repeat treatment weekly.


Important! If you also keep tarantulas, feeder roaches/dubias, crickets, etc. do not use the No-Pest Strip as it can kill them too!!!!


*** Mild Dish Soap ***


One or two drops of mild dish detergent in your snake's bath water will break the surface tension and prevent mites from floating in the water so they drown. No more than that is needed, your snake should not look like it is taking a bubble bath.


*** Heat ***


Don't laugh, but a temperature of 135*F for five seconds will kill mites and the eggs. I purchased a heat gun used for stripping paint that can be set to blow hot air from 180*F through 1200*F. Using the heat gun and a temperature gun I heated the surfaces and crevices of my racks and enclosures to kill off any mite eggs that may have been laid outside the tubs. Don't get your enclosure surfaces and joined/glued areas too hot or you can damage them.


Mite treatment should continue for 30 days after you stop finding mites on your snake, as an egg can take that long to hatch.


*** FINAL NOTES ***


Effective quarantine means that you treat every new arrival as if it has mites, and new snakes are kept as far away from your established collection as possible for at least 90 days. At the very least new critters should never be in the same room with your established collection.


I treat the quarantine enclosure, hides, and paper substrate with permethrin a day or so before the new snake arrives, and I wipe the snake with a paper towel soaked in Reptile Spray as part of my inspection process when it comes out of the shipping box. If the snake has mites I will know it within a day or two at most. This also goes for snakes from "trusted" sources, my first mite outbreak ever came from someone I trusted.


Finally, a mite egg can take up to 30 days to hatch. So, suppose you treat for a week or so and you think the mites are gone... but there are some eggs left. You stop treating. The eggs hatch a few weeks later, the mites grow up, and the females lay eggs. After six to eight weeks those eggs are hatching and you notice a full-blown infestation. So, if you think you "keep getting mites", you're not: you failed to eradicate the original infestation. Mite treatments should continue for 30 days after you stop finding them.

[Armiyana]

Does the rack itself need to be sprayed with pam or just the tubs?

Seconding Boger's question...Are these rodent mites/lice or snake mites?
Or could be none of the above depending on the bedding... I didn't see a description other than crawling on the snakes and tubs. Did you acquire a new snake recently? Have you brought home a new bag of bedding from a seller that may have had snake mites? Regardless of mite, I would toss all bedding. These may not be related to your snake at all and can be a type of wood mite. Rodent mites will usually die off on their own after a couple of weeks, but it sounds like it's not due to the number in the tubs? Lice will bite humans, but won't infest. If you're keeping rodents, I would check them all for infestations as well.

If these are indeed snake mites, you will need to spray the rack and surrounding areas/crevices. Mites can wander quite a bit away to lay eggs.