Wiggles, the Children's Python

[Bogertophis]

My tongs are 12". He didn't strike at the prey, miss, and hit me. He turned from the prey and launched directly at me. My tongs could have been 25" and he still would have gotten me. Gloves should protect me though. Mine are thick, waterproof gloves you see fisherman use. They'll not only protect my hands from a bite, but also mask the heat from my hands, so he won't try. That's what I hope at least.

Oh, okay- in that case, put your gloves in the freezer for a while first. You know, they make super-long & well-padded fireplace gloves too... (I used to have some, but no longer need them.)

[plateOfFlan]

Yesterday’s target training was a bit of a muddle. I got a pinkie to go with the hopper that I usually feed, so I had two opportunities. The pinkie went normally. He didn’t have a particularly strong reaction to the target, but it was good enough. For the hopper, I decided to set up a little foraging exercise for him, but I didn’t what to break with the target training, so I put the mouse in front of the target. Well, that didn’t work.

First, he is not used to taking two prey items. After the pinkie, he went into his hide to digest. He came out halfway a few times, flicking and yawning. I think he sensed the hopper, but he wasn’t interested enough to go hunting for it. After a while, I moved his hide closer to it. He came out of the hide completely but couldn’t find it. So, I gave up on foraging and decided to have another target training. That didn’t work either.

He saw the hopper as soon as I picked it up, so he ignored the target and went straight for it. I put the target directly between him and the hopper, but I don’t think he noticed it. I fed him the hopper anyway.

It was a muddle because I started target training, switched to foraging, and back to target training all with a snake that not adept at either. No wonder he was confused. You live, you learn. Even experienced trainers have bad sessions. At least he ate.

I've noticed going into the hide and coming back out seems to "reset" their behavior with my ball pythons and they'll often go back into food mode. I wonder if snakes have poor object permanence? It seems like that going in and coming out makes them forget what was going on before. In any case I always make sure to keep my hands and everything well clear when they come back out because sometimes they'll act kind of weird, like they're surprised to find me outside even though they just saw me. Losing sight of me during handling also often makes them come back to sniff me even if they just did a moment ago, like they need to make sure I'm still the same person. This isn't very helpful I guess, I just think it's an interesting behavior thing. Maybe entering the hide kind of broke the sequence you were training?

[Bogertophis]

I've noticed going into the hide and coming back out seems to "reset" their behavior with my ball pythons and they'll often go back into food mode. I wonder if snakes have poor object permanence? It seems like that going in and coming out makes them forget what was going on before. In any case I always make sure to keep my hands and everything well clear when they come back out because sometimes they'll act kind of weird, like they're surprised to find me outside even though they just saw me. Losing sight of me during handling also often makes them come back to sniff me even if they just did a moment ago, like they need to make sure I'm still the same person. This isn't very helpful I guess, I just think it's an interesting behavior thing. Maybe entering the hide kind of broke the sequence you were training?

I agree- I think they actually do need to reconnect with our scent or touch- because snakes (at least most of them) don't appear to recognize us visually. Both scent & touch can really help- once you set a snake down, they're easily startled without us showing "I.D." again. They're quite different from most other animals-they take some getting used to.

[plateOfFlan]

I agree- I think they actually do need to reconnect with our scent or touch- because snakes (at least most of them) don't appear to recognize us visually. Both scent & touch can really help- once you set a snake down, they're easily startled without us showing "I.D." again. They're quite different from most other animals-they take some getting used to.

They're definitely different, my hat's off to Homebody for going so deep on training. Even getting them used to handling is frustrating because it seems like you're often back at square one with a confused and frightened snake staring at you like they've never met you before in their life and have no idea what you intend to do with them.

[Homebody]

I've noticed going into the hide and coming back out seems to "reset" their behavior with my ball pythons and they'll often go back into food mode. I wonder if snakes have poor object permanence? It seems like that going in and coming out makes them forget what was going on before. In any case I always make sure to keep my hands and everything well clear when they come back out because sometimes they'll act kind of weird, like they're surprised to find me outside even though they just saw me. Losing sight of me during handling also often makes them come back to sniff me even if they just did a moment ago, like they need to make sure I'm still the same person. This isn't very helpful I guess, I just think it's an interesting behavior thing. Maybe entering the hide kind of broke the sequence you were training?

I don't think going into the hide caused the bite. I think a cool prey item and a warm hand confused him. I think it's pretty funny, actually. I'm dangling the pinkie right in front of his face. My mammalian mind is thinking, "It's right there! How can you not see that?!" But he's not a mammal, so he uses his heat pits to see. That's why he's confused. To his reptilian mind the prey looks like nothing. My hand on the other hand, that has potential. I just need to learn to see things from his perspective and that's going to take a while.

[Homebody]

I wonder if snakes have poor object permanence? It seems like that going in and coming out makes them forget what was going on before. In any case I always make sure to keep my hands and everything well clear when they come back out because sometimes they'll act kind of weird, like they're surprised to find me outside even though they just saw me. Losing sight of me during handling also often makes them come back to sniff me even if they just did a moment ago, like they need to make sure I'm still the same person. This isn't very helpful I guess, I just think it's an interesting behavior thing.

I agree. The first time Wiggles bit me I was changing his water. I carefully introduced myself, grabbed his water bowl, and went to fill it. He bit me when I put the water bowl back. In the thirty seconds it took me to fill the water bowl, he forgot who I was.

[Homebody]

Oh, okay- in that case, put your gloves in the freezer for a while first. You know, they make super-long & well-padded fireplace gloves too... (I used to have some, but no longer need them.)

I think it's funny that you're suggesting I use "super-long & well padded fireplace gloves" with a snake that has a head smaller than the tip of my pinkie. It just goes to show how ferocious Antaresia can be, but a least he's not a retic. With apologies to all the retic lovers out there, but every time Wiggles bites me I think, "Thank God he's not a retic."

[Bogertophis]

I think it's funny that you're suggesting I use "super-long & well padded fireplace gloves" with a snake that has a head smaller than the tip of my pinkie. It just goes to show how ferocious Antaresia can be, but a least he's not a retic. With apologies to all the retic lovers out there, but every time Wiggles bites me I think, "Thank God he's not a retic."

Well, it wasn't a real serious suggestion anyway...I was laughing. But frozen gloves might feel good, especially in the summertime?

[Homebody]

Well, it wasn't a real serious suggestion anyway...I was laughing. But frozen gloves might feel good, especially in the summertime?

I'm not sure it's a bad idea. My gloves stop at the wrist. What's to stop him from biting my forearm? Anyway, I'll give the fisherman's gloves and warmer prey a go. Welder's gloves or chainmail if that doesn't work.

[Bogertophis]

I'm not sure it's a bad idea. My gloves stop at the wrist. What's to stop him from biting my forearm? Anyway, I'll give the fisherman's gloves and warmer prey a go. Welder's gloves or chainmail if that doesn't work.

Yeah, that's how you know their dinner isn't warm enough-

You mentioned chainmail- somewhere there's a photo of that on this forum -someone posted. Most of the good ideas are already out there.