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  1. #21
    bcr229's Avatar
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    Re: New Lacey Act Amendments

    Quote Originally Posted by Homebody View Post
    2. The Secretary of the Interior will be able to add species to the injurious species list much more easily. In fact, you won't find out a species you breed or keep is being added until it has already happened, so there will be no way to stop it. We don't know to what extent the Secretary will use this power. She could add a bunch of commonly kept species to the list on day one, or she may not add a single species for the rest of her tenure. We don't know. We do know that every species added to the list will suffer the same fate as the retics and burms.
    This is incorrect. The amendment does away with the Lacey Act injurious species list and it will be replaced with a "white list" of approved animals. Anything not on the white list will be deemed injurious and thus not importable or transportable across state lines.

    This bill presents a fundamental change in how our laws have historically worked. In the past anything not explicitly declared illegal is by default legal, and it's how our government operates for all policies, not just animal species. By specifying a "white list" of what is legal - meaning some unelected government employee or official has to take steps to add species to a list - anything not on the list is automatically illegal whether or not that species is invasive/injurious.


    It wasn't all that long ago that the Tarahumara boa "locality" of boa imperator was actually declared its own species Boa Sigma. If this law were in place then anyone who owned a Tarahumara suddenly wouldn't be able to transport or ship them interstate until some government agency studied them and determined whether or not they should be added to the whitelist. This can happen with almost any exotic critter.


    I am in the eastern panhandle of WV and this really affects me as we don't have any exotic vet specialists local. There is one in Hagerstown, MD, and others in Winchester, Berryville, and Fairfax, VA. If this law passes I'd have to drive the critter on state or county roads to Charleston, WV which would take about 8 hours each way.

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  3. #22
    BPnet Veteran Erie_herps's Avatar
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    Re: New Lacey Act Amendments

    Quote Originally Posted by Snagrio View Post
    Gotta wonder what big box pet stores (PetSmart, Petco, ect.) think of this. Because it has the potential to take a MASSIVE bite out of their profits if commonly kept animals keep getting put on the list willy nilly (not only could they not sell animals, but eventually it would render the products they sell FOR those animals moot as well). The one time where corporate lobbying would work in our favor if things come to blows...

    And like Crowfingers pointed out, this whole thing is one of the endless examples of how clueless and backwards the intentions of the government are. If they truly actually cared about limiting invasive species and protecting biodiversity, domestic cats would be the first thing on that list due to the untold damage they cause to ecosystems (one cat outright wiped out an entire population of birds on an island once for crying out loud). The fact that this bill was tucked under another one also tells me what this is really about. More control. More wagging their fingers at what we aren't allowed to do. And they think they can get away with it by going for more "acceptable targets" first in exotic animal keepers, which if they do, who knows if that will embolden them to try and remove the right to keep ANY animals, because that's how the lust for power grows. Give an inch, take a mile. Every time.
    I've emailed a couple large pet stores telling them about this. It would probably be good for lots of us to do the same. Because there's no way that they are going to let this pass.
    I agree with the rest of your post, the extremist animal rights group are the ones behind this, like dozens of other bills. The goal isn't to help the wild populations or preserve human health (there have only been about 10 deaths from nonvenomous captive snakes ever recorded, compared to about 30-50 deaths from dog attacks per year), it's all about control and removing all animals from our lives.

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  5. #23
    BPnet Veteran Snagrio's Avatar
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    So when is the deadline for this whole thing anyway? Genuinely have been losing sleep over it...

  6. #24
    BPnet Veteran Homebody's Avatar
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    Re: New Lacey Act Amendments

    Quote Originally Posted by Snagrio View Post
    So when is the deadline for this whole thing anyway? Genuinely have been losing sleep over it...
    During the Dav Kaufman segment, Phil Goss of USARK said the time to act isn't for weeks. Now, is the time to get educated. Congress is in recess. When they get back their first priority will be passing the budget. After that, they will turn to the COMPETES ACT. Stay tuned for USARK alerts. They will tell us when they need us to act.
    Last edited by Homebody; 02-13-2022 at 11:01 AM.

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  8. #25
    BPnet Veteran Homebody's Avatar
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    Re: New Lacey Act Amendments

    Quote Originally Posted by bcr229 View Post
    This is incorrect. The amendment does away with the Lacey Act injurious species list and it will be replaced with a "white list" of approved animals. Anything not on the white list will be deemed injurious and thus not importable or transportable across state lines.
    I've heard that from credible sources, but I don't agree. The amendment to section (a)(1) gives the Secretary the emergency power to add a species to the injurious species list. That doesn't make sense if there is no injurious species list. Furthermore, section (d)(1), added by another amendment, refers to the (a)(1) injurious species list. Again, this wouldn't make sense if there isn't an injurious species list. I do agree that these amendments are potentially disastrous to the exotic pet community.

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  10. #26
    BPnet Veteran Trinityblood's Avatar
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    Re: New Lacey Act Amendments

    Quote Originally Posted by Bogertophis View Post
    But only if you're actually READY to take it on- financially & physically & in terms of your living situation- all animals deserve good homes, & they deserve to NOT be an "impulse-buy". "Just because you can...doesn't mean you should."
    I'm avoiding this temptation. I want a boa and will be really sad if I suddenly can't get one...but I'm not ready for one yet. I wrote my senators and donated to USARK. Not sure there's much else I can do.

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  12. #27
    Bogertophis's Avatar
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    Re: New Lacey Act Amendments

    Quote Originally Posted by Trinityblood View Post
    I'm avoiding this temptation. I want a boa and will be really sad if I suddenly can't get one...but I'm not ready for one yet. I wrote my senators and donated to USARK. Not sure there's much else I can do.
    I hope & sincerely believe they'll be surprised at the amount of push-back they get. So many of us keeping reptiles ("exotic" pets) are low-key about it, & when law-makers don't hear about something, it doesn't exist for them until it's in their face.
    Rudeness is the weak man's imitation of strength.
    Eric Hoffer (1902 - 1983)

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  14. #28
    Bogertophis's Avatar
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    Re: New Lacey Act Amendments

    Quote Originally Posted by Homebody View Post
    During the Dav Kaufman segment, Phil Goss of USARK said the time to act isn't for weeks. Now, is the time to get educated. Congress is in recess. When they get back their first priority will be passing the budget. After that, they will turn to the COMPETES ACT. Stay tuned for USARK alerts. They will tell us when they need us to act.
    I don't think it would hurt one bit to start politely contacting them NOW with your opposition to these horrible changes, but please don't think it's a "One & Done" effort.

    If you contact them now, great, but don't forget that it's not over...don't forget to "rinse & repeat" as necessary, & especially when USARK alerts us all.

    We NEED EVERYONE in this effort. "United we stand..." (divided, we're toast)
    Rudeness is the weak man's imitation of strength.
    Eric Hoffer (1902 - 1983)

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  16. #29
    BPnet Veteran Trinityblood's Avatar
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    Re: New Lacey Act Amendments

    Quote Originally Posted by Bogertophis View Post
    I hope & sincerely believe they'll be surprised at the amount of push-back they get. So many of us keeping reptiles ("exotic" pets) are low-key about it, & when law-makers don't hear about something, it doesn't exist for them until it's in their face.
    Same here. This effects so many different types of pet keepers and I'm glad I'm seeing different hobbyist groups bringing it up.

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  18. #30
    BPnet Veteran WrongPython's Avatar
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    Re: New Lacey Act Amendments

    Quote Originally Posted by Homebody View Post
    I've heard that from credible sources, but I don't agree. The amendment to section (a)(1) gives the Secretary the emergency power to add a species to the injurious species list. That doesn't make sense if there is no injurious species list. Furthermore, section (d)(1), added by another amendment, refers to the (a)(1) injurious species list. Again, this wouldn't make sense if there isn't an injurious species list. I do agree that these amendments are potentially disastrous to the exotic pet community.
    To sum up the dense legal-ese used to write legislative stuff is complicated, the proposed Lacey amendment does two things on these fronts.

    One: the Secretary of the Interior (functionally, Department of the Interior agencies such as USFWS) have more unilateral authority to quickly add species to the injurious list in an emergency situation. The injurious list is still very much a thing with this amendment; it's not going away. If anything, it could become longer and/or stronger since species could be immediately added to the list via the new emergency listing provision this amendment proposes -- normally it can take quite some time to get species listed as injurious due to mandatory public comment periods and related requirements of regulatory procedures. Section (a) of the proposed amendment includes the injurious list changes.

    Two: importation moves from "blacklist" territory (ie. you can import any given species unless it's on a ban list) to "whitelist" territory (ie. you can't import any given species unless it's on a list of approved species). Section (d) "Presumptive Prohibition on Importation" appears to be establishing the whitelist mechanism.

    So yeah, the injurious list is still very much a thing, and a transition to a whitelist-based importation schedule is there.

    Even though the final reconciliation and vote on this bill isn't likely to occur for a few weeks, the time to act is now. Look at this way: the sooner we speak up and bring our concerns to senators' attention, the sooner this stuff may be taken out. This isn't something you want to wait until the deadline for. Keep spreading the word, contact your senators, and stay aware.

    And please do contact your senators! Like Phil said in the stream, legislative officials don't really pay attention to petitions and rely upon their constituents reaching out to them directly to know when something's up. So use those USARK email templates, contact your senators, and let your voice be heard! Early reports from other reptile peeps show that legislators are listening. One person I know was actually able to speak to a live person when they called the office, and a fairly well-known boa breeder on Instagram got a nice letter back from their rep. This isn't a hopeless battle unless we let it be.
    0.1 Sonoran Boa sigma​: "Adelita" ('19 Hypo het. leopard)
    1.0 Boa imperator longicauda: "Kuzco" ('19 het. anery)
    0.1 West Papuan Morelia spilota​: "Pandora" ('20)

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