My Ball isn't eating.. Help!

[Slither_My_Timbers96]

My ball python just turned 1 around Mid-November and he hasn't eaten for me once. I had gotten him from a breeder and the last time he ate from them is in June a week before I had received him. It just seems like 5 months is a long time for a 1 year old BP to not eat. I keep hearing that its typical that they go off of eating for a long time but now I am getting concerned. When I took him to the vet in October they weighed him at 180 grams. I had weighed him earlier this month and he had dropped to 168 grams. But his body doesn't seem unhealthy, just a little on the slim side. His urates seem normal from what I can tell. (I am not sure how to post pictures on here but if someone can let me know I will definitely post one.)

Little background on the set up. I have him in a cluttered 40 gallon tank with a UTH that is kept on a thermostat with the temps at around 85-94. I do have an ambient temperature that typically runs from 88 on the hot side and like 75 on the cool side. The humidity runs between 50%-60% and upwards of about 70%-80% when he is in shed (He has actually given me a perfect full body shed so that's a positive). I had started him on Eco Earth Coconut Fiber substrate and have switched him to Cyprus Mulch. I have 2 of the same hides on both sides of the tank and a half log just for extra enrichment. I have a tall ceramic or resin (not sure on the material but its not made out of wood) wood sculpture thing for climbing if he were to want to but he doesn't use it much anymore. There are hanging 3 fake hanging plants and about 4 or 5 fake ground plants. I have both sides of the tank painted black and one of those Tropical Backgrounds taped to the outside of his tank to cover the back.

Like the change with the substrate, I have tried changing the color of the feeders from Dark Brown or Black to White Mice with no luck, I tried to offer it wet and blow dried, I tried the point the blow dryer towards the tank so the smell goes that way trick, I have tried wiggling the prey and leaving it overnight. I have tried stretching the offerings from once a week to once every 2 weeks. I moved his tank from one area of my apartment to our bedroom which is only used when we go to bed and is generally really quiet. And even as a last ditch effort, I tried to offer live.. still no luck..

Am I doing something wrong? Is there something I haven't done yet or is there something off sounding with his set-up or temps? Am I overreacting? He is my first snake and I just want to make sure he is ok.

Any help or advise will be greatly appreciated. Thank you for your time.

[Bogertophis]

How does his current home compare to his former one (@ the breeder)? I'm betting it's huge & maybe he was kept in a tub previously? If so (& you should ASK to be SURE), it might be that he doesn't feel "secure" (safe) in such a large home. I know, it seems & it sounds like you've "bent over backwards" to give him a nice place to live, but BPs can be picky that way. They're nocturnal ambush-predators- they like to grab clueless prey that gets too near their hiding place. If they go out in the open in the wild, there are predators waiting to eat THEM- so they're not active hunters- they like to lurk from the doorway of their hide.

How often do you handle this snake? Be honest... -this might be the issue.

The warmest area is too hot at 94*, btw- most here agree that the warmest area they can touch should be between 88*-91* at the most, for safety. But I don't think that's his problem.

How often are you offering food? Too often may ensure more refusals because they feel stressed. At first, you should have offered food weekly (not more than that ever) but after that is an obvious "no-go", lengthen the time between offers of prey to 2 weeks apart. Feed only at night- dim light- & preferably when he's peeking out of his hide- never when he's roaming out in the "open".

Be sure you're offering the type prey he was raised on. If you didn't ask before, you must ask now. (rats or mice, size/wts., live or f/t or fresh-killed- all can make a HUGE difference)

If he's not eating, he's probably not producing much stool, but when he did, did it look normal? If you get any fresh stool, it wouldn't hurt to have a vet check it for parasites.

If you need to find a qualified herp vet near you, this might help: https://arav.site-ym.com/search/custom.asp?id=3661

[Slither_My_Timbers96]

Hi! You know what, I didn't even think to ask them that question so I will give it a shot!

I have been avoiding handling him cause I read an article that said that that could stress them out a lot.. but to be honest I have lifted him to check his underbelly and him in general (which I am sure probably isn't helping) so I will just limit to water changes. Oh, I also handled him a bit when I was taking him to the vet but he has his own travel container that I got for him so its not like I'm holding him more than necessary.

Oh, yikes! I certainly don't want to burn him so I will be sure to lower the temp to 90.

Well my offerings went from being 1 time a week to 1 time every 2 weeks and back to 1 time a week cause I started to get paranoid (that was like 3-4 days after I weighed him). I do offer him food at night but I notice he doesn't peek out of his hide anymore and typically doesn't switch hides until about 2-3 in the morning when I am asleep.

The cool thing about the breeder I got him from is they had a little card that had a chart that listed his last feeding (as to how I know it was in June). It said they were feeding him small f/t mice.

He hasn't pooped for me at all either.. I think maybe he did before he got shipped out to me cause all I have seen in his enclosure are urates.

I think maybe I should try a different vet cause she suggested moving him in a separate container for feedings and I heard that's a big "No-No" so definitely didn't do that. Also, she suggested that I try gerbil's? Would that be something to try? Thanks for the link!

[bcr229]

I think maybe I should try a different vet cause she suggested moving him in a separate container for feedings and I heard that's a big "No-No" so definitely didn't do that. Also, she suggested that I try gerbil's? Would that be something to try? Thanks for the link!

No, do not move your snake to feed it. That can throw them right out of food mode, and if it doesn't, it increases the chances of you getting bit.

Don't feed gerbils, you don't want your snake stuck on them.

Do you know how much your snake weighed when you got it versus now?

[Bogertophis]

Hi! You know what, I didn't even think to ask them that question so I will give it a shot!

I have been avoiding handling him cause I read an article that said that that could stress them out a lot.. but to be honest I have lifted him to check his underbelly and him in general (which I am sure probably isn't helping) so I will just limit to water changes. Oh, I also handled him a bit when I was taking him to the vet but he has his own travel container that I got for him so its not like I'm holding him more than necessary.

Oh, yikes! I certainly don't want to burn him so I will be sure to lower the temp to 90.

Well my offerings went from being 1 time a week to 1 time every 2 weeks and back to 1 time a week cause I started to get paranoid (that was like 3-4 days after I weighed him). I do offer him food at night but I notice he doesn't peek out of his hide anymore and typically doesn't switch hides until about 2-3 in the morning when I am asleep.

The cool thing about the breeder I got him from is they had a little card that had a chart that listed his last feeding (as to how I know it was in June). It said they were feeding him small f/t mice.

He hasn't pooped for me at all either.. I think maybe he did before he got shipped out to me cause all I have seen in his enclosure are urates.

I think maybe I should try a different vet cause she suggested moving him in a separate container for feedings and I heard that's a big "No-No" so definitely didn't do that. Also, she suggested that I try gerbil's? Would that be something to try? Thanks for the link!

Vet trips (even in a container) are SUPER-stressful. That's probably why (or part of the reason) he's not eating. The vet's handling 'counts' too.

Honestly, most of us don't ever take snakes for a routine vet check up- ONLY IF & when there's a visible health issue. Difficulty feeding is "usually" a husbandry issue, not a medical one, & most vets are the best at medical & surgical treatments. Discussing husbandry is time-consuming & involves techniques that they can't "sell you", if you get my drift, lol. That's why we're here.

And yes, the vet you saw gave you bad advice about feeding in another container, & also about feeding him gerbils at this point. Yes, BPs usually LOVE hamsters, gerbils & ASF's (<African soft-furred- these are actually their natural prey in the wild), BUT these things will cost much more AND your snake will probably never accept mice or rats thereafter, so be careful what you "try" as it's likely to become permanent. So consider your budget & local availability of these other rodents before you get out on that limb... (Some areas, ASF's are illegal too.)

Snake poo- baby snakes are eating baby rodents which are more digestible than adult rodents, so there's way less waste left over to expel. This question comes up a lot- many fear their snake is constipated, when usually they just don't have to go. A little waste just gets saved up until they have enough to "bother with"- in the wild, this also conserves water in their body, & since there's no drinking fountains out there for snakes, that also helps them survive. (That's also why they expel semi-solid "urates" instead of liquid urine.)

That's an excellent sign of a good responsible breeder to furnish a feeding record of their snakes.

[arpowell]

Sorry to hear you're having problems! I wanted to add to what Bogertophis said about your snake possibly not feeling secure. My bp is a rescue and was suuuuper scared and shy when I brought her home, so I have some tips to help a snake feel safer in its new home! Make sure the snake enclosure isn't sitting on the floor - it's best up on a dresser or a shelf so they can't feel vibrations from people walking by or doors opening throughout the house. It might help to drape a blanket over half the tank to keep it a bit darker and calmer, too - I have a high-strung little hognose and that really helps him feel safe. It sounds like you have a lot of clutter in there, which is great! Make sure you offer food when his head is just poking out of the hide, not when he's out and about. During feeding time, my snake and I also had a lot of success by pinning a blanket over the front of the enclosure so she couldn't see me while I was offering her food.

You might also have luck offering food really late if you can manage it. There was a time when I had to be up at 2 a.m. to get my snake to eat - you might have more success offering really late and in a dim room, and hopefully your snake will grow out of it. Mine did, and now she's a bottomless pit and doesn't even need her "safety blanket" during feedings anymore.

Also, you were absolutely right not to move your snake into a separate enclosure to feed. Good call! Personally, I wouldn't offer your snake gerbils. I've heard ball pythons really like them, but it's not a recommended option because gerbils stay so small and it can be hard to move a bp that likes gerbils back onto mice and rats. It seems like it's more expensive to feed gerbils, especially since it's so easy to find f/t mice and rats in comparison. One thing you might be able to try, though, is scenting your mice with african soft fur juice. They're the natural prey of bps in the wild and I've heard a lot of people have success with picky eaters with asf juice. You can buy asf juice from Reptilinks, here's a link if you want to give scenting a try.

Good luck, keep us updated!

[Slither_My_Timbers96]

Great advise, thank you! I have him on a stand but I just set up a tub so I will put him in it when the thermostat comes in.

I didn't know about ASF juice so I will definitely look for some! Thank you for the link!

[Slither_My_Timbers96]

No, do not move your snake to feed it. That can throw them right out of food mode, and if it doesn't, it increases the chances of you getting bit.

Don't feed gerbils, you don't want your snake stuck on them.

Do you know how much your snake weighed when you got it versus now?

Yeah, definitely not lol I knew that was a huge red flag. But, I didn't realize how expensive gerbils would be so I will work through the other alternatives.

Unfortunately, I don't remember how much he weighed exactly when I got him, but the ball pythons they sell are listed to weigh 70-110 grams. So it seems like pretty recently that he started to loose weight.

Thank you for your advice!

[EL-Ziggy]

I agree with dropping your warm side temps a few degrees but other than that it sounds like you’re doing the right thing. I’m not a believer in jumping through a lot of hoops with stubborn feeders, and unfortunately BPs can be the worst, so I say just stay the course. I’d scale back to offering food every 2-4 weeks until he decides to eat. The hunger always wins in the end.

[arpowell]

I agree with dropping your warm side temps a few degrees but other than that it sounds like you’re doing the right thing. I’m not a believer in jumping through a lot of hoops with stubborn feeders, and unfortunately BPs can be the worst, so I say just stay the course. I’d scale back to offering food every 2-4 weeks until he decides to eat. The hunger always wins in the end.

I will also say that offering food less frequently helped a lot even after I got my shy little bp to eat regularly for me. It wasn't until she'd been taking meals every other week for me for months that I transitioned her to eating every week. A big part of getting her eating for me so consistently was just not overwhelming her with offering every single week and making sure she was good and hungry by the time I offered again, so even once you get your bp eating, you might decide that offering food every other week or so works better for the two of you. Some snakes might just prefer to eat less frequently while they're still young and shy - although my girl would probably eat for me twice a week now if I let her, lol.