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Thread: Stop pushing!!

  1. #11
    BPnet Veteran Team Slytherin's Avatar
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    Re: Stop pushing!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Neko_snake View Post
    Thanks. I appreciate the confidence boost. I just know others probably have more experience with snakes so I just feel like I don't fully have the experience to say much lol.

    I know this might not be ideal but is there a way you could maybe take him outside even if it's to a nearby park or something. Maybe that could get his energy out. Although the outside world is definitely difficult with any snake like alone a big one so this might not be possible.

    Um... Maybe get a ladder that matches your deco and have that for him to climb on. Just take out or open when in use type thing?

    And I wonder if he just needs to keep doing the water bowl burrowing until he realizes that's not getting him anywhere or maybe moving the water bowl would help. I'm not sure how arboreal snakes work in that department.

    Sent from my moto z3 using Tapatalk
    I’ve been considering ways to take him outside for adventures. We did it when he was young, but it’s much more difficult now. If he grows much more, he will end up being a mandatory 2-person handle and I hope that doesn’t happen. Only time will tell; we don’t really know enough about the species yet to predict. He has already far outgrown the size at which they are believed to “max out.” He’s been handled much less the last couple years because I had a BRUTAL surgery and was just not able to handle him safely without injuring myself - and he is very aware of my limitations in this respect! He knows I am still not able to hold my arms up over my head for more than 3 seconds at a time, so when he wants to be out but avoid me, he will curl up on a curtain rod above the window and just turn his face away from me🤣 I think it would be useful to purchase one of those collapsable mesh “play pens” for dogs. It would make transport easier to outdoor spots and also give me the option to safely and comfortably confine him if he gets too rowdy.

    I guess that is an important thing to reiterate🤣 He is not at all like a boa, especially a large one. Apophis is not just active, he is CRAZY smart, ultra athletic, and does NOT understand his strength. I’m sure most arboreal snakes are extra grabby, but scrubs have a tendency to hold on to an object (or human) MUCH harder than is necessary. He’s a sweet, sweet good boy, but I have no doubt he could easily kill a grown man and not even realize. The point of mentioning it, I suppose, is that I just don’t see something like a jungle gym being enough to keep him interested. My Dumeril’s can be swaddled in a blanket and put on the couch to watch documentaries without moving a muscle. But watching him outside of the cage is a full time job! And getting him to do something/go somewhere he doesn’t want to? Good luck!! I am currently laying groundwork to begin target training him for this exact reason!

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    Bogertophis (11-08-2021)

  3. #12
    Registered User Neko_snake's Avatar
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    Re: Stop pushing!!

    Quote Originally Posted by Team Slytherin View Post
    I’ve been considering ways to take him outside for adventures. We did it when he was young, but it’s much more difficult now. If he grows much more, he will end up being a mandatory 2-person handle and I hope that doesn’t happen. Only time will tell; we don’t really know enough about the species yet to predict. He has already far outgrown the size at which they are believed to “max out.” He’s been handled much less the last couple years because I had a BRUTAL surgery and was just not able to handle him safely without injuring myself - and he is very aware of my limitations in this respect! He knows I am still not able to hold my arms up over my head for more than 3 seconds at a time, so when he wants to be out but avoid me, he will curl up on a curtain rod above the window and just turn his face away from me I think it would be useful to purchase one of those collapsable mesh “play pens” for dogs. It would make transport easier to outdoor spots and also give me the option to safely and comfortably confine him if he gets too rowdy.

    I guess that is an important thing to reiterate He is not at all like a boa, especially a large one. Apophis is not just active, he is CRAZY smart, ultra athletic, and does NOT understand his strength. I’m sure most arboreal snakes are extra grabby, but scrubs have a tendency to hold on to an object (or human) MUCH harder than is necessary. He’s a sweet, sweet good boy, but I have no doubt he could easily kill a grown man and not even realize. The point of mentioning it, I suppose, is that I just don’t see something like a jungle gym being enough to keep him interested. My Dumeril’s can be swaddled in a blanket and put on the couch to watch documentaries without moving a muscle. But watching him outside of the cage is a full time job! And getting him to do something/go somewhere he doesn’t want to? Good luck!! I am currently laying groundwork to begin target training him for this exact reason!
    Makes sense. That sounds like a great idea to target train him. Any big "dangerous" animal probably should be target trained. Especially this athletic, smart, but also doesn't know his own strength guy. If you guy him target trained you could do so much with him. Handling could be more like a training session and ideally he'll go where you want him to.

    The physical limitations you have probably haven't helped much but it's awesome that you're still trying and don't seem willing to give up on this animal. If this was a cat or dog I feel like others would just label them bad/annoying dog and just try to re-home it but you looking for solutions and I think that's admirable.

    Sent from my moto z3 using Tapatalk

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    Team Slytherin (11-09-2021)

  5. #13
    BPnet Lifer EL-Ziggy's Avatar
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    Re: Stop pushing!!

    I don’t know sis. He’s got a beautiful enclosure and he gets out for exercise fairly regularly. I keep my hot spot closer to 86-88. You could try slightly cooler temps. Maybe it’s seasonal or hormonal but I’d try feeding him a little more often. He’s a BIG growing boy and even though they can survive on very little food, he still has a big appetite. Some folks forget that big snakes need big food. We can’t feed scrubs like kingsnakes and BPs. Nobody wants an obese snake, but I don’t want a snake that’s always hungry either. My scrub is about the same age/size as Pop, Klauss may be a little thicker, but the only time he’s ultra restless is when he’s hungry. He eats a large or jumbo rat every 2-3 weeks. After a meal he’ll usually stay perched for a few days. After that he’ll be active at night but he never pushes. My Olive python will push a bit when he’s hungry but he mellows right out after a meal. He eats every 2-3 weeks as well. I also agree that a jungle gym or cat tree might be a good idea. I’m not patient enough for choice based handling or target training, and getting Klauss out of his enclosure can sometimes be a challenge, but he seems to enjoy the jungle gym I had made. He’ll stay on it for a good bit before he climbs down onto the floor. I’ll let him stretch out for 15-30 minutes and then back to the enclosure. I’m sure you’ll figure out what’s got him so antsy. Let us know how you fix it. ✌🏾❤️
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  6. #14
    BPnet Veteran Team Slytherin's Avatar
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    Re: Stop pushing!!

    Quote Originally Posted by EL-Ziggy View Post
    I don’t know sis. He’s got a beautiful enclosure and he gets out for exercise fairly regularly. I keep my hot spot closer to 86-88. You could try slightly cooler temps. Maybe it’s seasonal or hormonal but I’d try feeding him a little more often. He’s a BIG growing boy and even though they can survive on very little food, he still has a big appetite. Some folks forget that big snakes need big food. We can’t feed scrubs like kingsnakes and BPs. Nobody wants an obese snake, but I don’t want a snake that’s always hungry either. My scrub is about the same age/size as Pop, Klauss may be a little thicker, but the only time he’s ultra restless is when he’s hungry. He eats a large or jumbo rat every 2-3 weeks. After a meal he’ll usually stay perched for a few days. After that he’ll be active at night but he never pushes. My Olive python will push a bit when he’s hungry but he mellows right out after a meal. He eats every 2-3 weeks as well. I also agree that a jungle gym or cat tree might be a good idea. I’m not patient enough for choice based handling or target training, and getting Klauss out of his enclosure can sometimes be a challenge, but he seems to enjoy the jungle gym I had made. He’ll stay on it for a good bit before he climbs down onto the floor. I’ll let him stretch out for 15-30 minutes and then back to the enclosure. I’m sure you’ll figure out what’s got him so antsy. Let us know how you fix it. ✌🏾❤️
    Thank you for your insight, Lee!! That makes me feel better. I was actually going to ask you how often you feed Klauss! His body condition is good and if that is his schedule, I think I am under feeding. I’ve wondered if that was the case for awhile - they have such slender necks, it’s incredibly deceiving! And I got paranoid that the scrub keepers would judge me for having a fat boy🤣🤣 A certain person who was the first to breed them in the US specifically cautioned me about it early on - saying he has bred them at 400 grams and never had one exceed 5 feet. Apophis is already pushing 8 feet and he’s only 5 or 6 years old!

    So the point is: I think you’re right. I bet he’s probably hungry. I doubt that’s what it’s all about…but likely a big player. Heat could also be one! He just loves sitting in the absolute hottest spot he can, so I just assumed that was fine🤷🏻:cens0r:♀️. I mean, his temps are set based upon the highs and lows of the Tanimbars (which I check regularly), so I didn’t pull it out of a hat or anything.🤣 But 2 of the guys from the group, Mack and John, came over to help me with the cage recently and I know they keep their scrubs in the temperature range you mentioned. So I’ll drop his hot spot for a week or so and see how that goes! I bet he will be more relaxed. Even though I’m sitting by him right now and he has been tucked up in that hot spot for the entire day!! He has nearly given me a heart attack before, trying to get as close to the lights as possible - he’ll bask under a 95 degree hot spot for hours. He’s a weirdo. I bet that’s like giving a Red Bull to a toddler, though. I’ll drop his temps and THEN feed him more😉

    Also - I’m 100% sure the only reason we successfully practice “choice based handling” is because he’s always trying to escape!🤣🤣🤣

    Thank you SO much for your suggestions - it is all extremely useful!✨

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