Basking spot and UVB

[Snagrio]

Sometime this week my T10 from Animal Plastics (4'x2'x15") is supposed to arrive, and one thing I'd really like to try is giving him a basking bulb and UVB. The enclosure will come with a RHP pre-installed for ambient temperature but I've been reading on how BPs actually like to bask more than what used to be supposed, and UVB I want to set up to him period because there's no reason not to.

I know what brand I'm looking for (Arcadia, everyone seems to swear by them) and what type of UVB bulb (a "shade dweller" T5 with 7% UVB) but I do have some questions.

Should the lights be on the same end as the RHP?

How much of the enclosure should the UVB fixture cover?

What kind of basking bulb should I use (was thinking halogen)? And how many watts?

How many hours per day should they be left on?

[KMG]

I think that is overkill.

A UV while you say there is no reason not to the reverse could also be said, there is no reason to. I have a UV over my Ball tank but that is because it has plants inside....not for the snake. She is hardly ever out when that light is on.

As to the RHP and a heat bulb. I think you may be underestimating how well a AP cage will hold the heat. One or the other is all you should need. Unless you are dealing with some really cold temps.


Should the lights be on the same end as the RHP?

I wouldn't think so. Like I said you should only need one or the other. I would stick with the RHP as you don't have to worry about a bulb going out.

How much of the enclosure should the UVB fixture cover?

No clue and I wouldn't add it unless you have an actual need.

What kind of basking bulb should I use (was thinking halogen)? And how many watts?

I would get a 60w and a dimmer. If you use both this bulb and the RHP neither will need much power so a tstat for both would be best but at a minimmum a tstat for the RHP and a dimmer for the bulb will be needed, IMO.

How many hours per day should they be left on?

I have lights in most of my cages as well as day light in the room. At night I have a floor lamp with two bulbs for viewing at night. I just run them on a standard light cycle. When it is light out the lights are on and when it's dark the room is dark.

[Hugsplox]

I think that is overkill.

A UV while you say there is no reason not to the reverse could also be said, there is no reason to. I have a UV over my Ball tank but that is because it has plants inside....not for the snake. She is hardly ever out when that light is on.

As to the RHP and a heat bulb. I think you may be underestimating how well a AP cage will hold the heat. One or the other is all you should need. Unless you are dealing with some really cold temps.

100% agree with KMG, I think adding all this extra lighting is going to increase your temps and cause more harm than good. UVBs don't typically get super hot, but they do raise ambient temps a bit and as KMG said, you may be underestimating how well that enclosure is going to hold in all that heat. I would suggest just getting your enclosure, putting it together, and seeing how your boy does in there. You can always add equipment later but I don't see a point in spending money on equipment you don't need.

[TofuTofuTofu]

So, this is something I want to do with my setup too, but I haven't looked into what size I would need yet. There is a UVB guide by Reptiles and Research, who advocates for UVB with snakes (I haven't gone into watching it, but this person has several videos regarding UVB and snakes). There's a segment on selecting the position of the bulb.

As for a basking lamp, I'm not sure you'd need a separate one in addition to the UVB? I could be wrong, though. I think they will exhibit basking behavior with the UVB lamp only, even if it isn't very hot.

If it were me, I would set it up without it and see what the temperature is. Then, add the UVB and take temps over a day or two and see what difference it makes--all before putting the snake in. I think you can make it work, but you might just have to tweak it a bit and see what kind of difference, if any, it makes temp-wise.

You may be able to tell from a few of his other videos if it's on the same side as the heat or not, or it may even be covered in the video I linked--again, sorry, I don't have the time at this moment to double check for you. I have actually emailed this Youtuber before with questions and he did respond right away, so maybe you could even ask him!

[Snagrio]

I had an inkling that all that heat-producing equipment would be too much, but thought I'd ask anyway. I've just been reading a lot about how people say their BPs became more "lively" and such after they added things like UVB. But I'll see what things are like when it gets here and is set up with the RHP first before do anything else.

As a side note, it will come with LEDs. Will those be enough for daytime lighting cycle purposes or would I need something more?

[KMG]

So, this is something I want to do with my setup too, but I haven't looked into what size I would need yet. There is a UVB guide by Reptiles and Research, who advocates for UVB with snakes (I haven't gone into watching it, but this person has several videos regarding UVB and snakes). There's a segment on selecting the position of the bulb.

As for a basking lamp, I'm not sure you'd need a separate one in addition to the UVB? I could be wrong, though. I think they will exhibit basking behavior with the UVB lamp only, even if it isn't very hot.

If it were me, I would set it up without it and see what the temperature is. Then, add the UVB and take temps over a day or two and see what difference it makes--all before putting the snake in. I think you can make it work, but you might just have to tweak it a bit and see what kind of difference, if any, it makes temp-wise.

You may be able to tell from a few of his other videos if it's on the same side as the heat or not, or it may even be covered in the video I linked--again, sorry, I don't have the time at this moment to double check for you. I have actually emailed this Youtuber before with questions and he did respond right away, so maybe you could even ask him!

I went looking but wasn't impressed. He didn't convince me of anything in what I watched. He said he wrote a paper and got a high grade. So....that doesn't mean it was correct. Just that he did well in presenting his topic and hypothesis.

He also says it's true that snakes can get what they need from their food and then throws in a BUT trying to justify his beliefs.

He also mentioned UVB working against RI. Why? If you're having a repeat issue with RI it's not the light. How do breeders using nothing but tubs not have such issues?

This is the one I skimmed through.
https://youtu.be/OxgJVFYjC0Y

[KMG]

As a side note, it will come with LEDs. Will those be enough for daytime lighting cycle purposes or would I need something more?

They'll do great. I have led in mine from them and they are plenty bright. The ones I have ordered will have it too.

I do like offering light. I'm just not convinced on the UV thing. It's a cost that hiding snakes are not utilizing in a way to be cost effective to me.

I wonder if the snakes actually became more lively or if they wanted to escape it. Say you have two identical cages connected with a tunnel. The only difference is one has UV. Which would they choose? If anything knows of testing like that I'd be interested in seeing it.

[Hugsplox]

I went looking but wasn't impressed. He didn't convince me of anything in what I watched. He said he wrote a paper and got a high grade. So....that doesn't mean it was correct. Just that he did well in presenting his topic and hypothesis.

He also says it's true that snakes can get what they need from their food and then throws in a BUT trying to justify his beliefs.

He also mentioned UVB working against RI. Why? If you're having a repeat issue with RI it's not the light. How do breeders using nothing but tubs not have such issues?

This is the one I skimmed through.
https://youtu.be/OxgJVFYjC0Y

I wasn't super impressed with this either. A lot of reptiles need UVB for D3 purposes. That's why with a lot of gecko species, bearded dragons, etc etc you have to supplement. D3 is a vitamin that helps the body absorb calicum. It's a pretty simple process, UVB helps create a pre-vitamin form of D3, and then heat converts that to a vitamin form. Most snakes absorb the D3 from the prey item, eliminating the "need" for UVB or any kind of supplement.

That's not to say you might see some behavioral changes if you provide UVB, and if I'm not mistaken there have been some larger studies on using UVB with crepuscular and nocturnal reptiles, but I don't think there's really been a breakthrough showing a huge health benefit.

[Snagrio]

So, in general, unless a given species isn't on vertebrate diet (partially or fully), or the species is otherwise known to bask frequently and thus WOULD actually get something out of a UVB bulb, there's generally not much reason to have UVB for snakes as a whole?

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[TofuTofuTofu]

I did not make my last post to argue about whether snakes need UVB; I was answering the question of this topic. "Need" is different from providing something that would enrich the snake's life, which would be UVB. Wanting to mimic nature more closely and providing the snake enrichment via UVB isn't going to hurt anything if done correctly--hence the original post asking how--and I find the "argument" about the necessity not helpful right now. Enrichment is never a bad thing if it is done safely.

I don't think UVB is regarded as a health benefit but it is used to more mimic a snake's natural environment. Even snakes that hide will bask for part of the day and get some amount of UVB in nature, and there's nothing wrong with adding this in captivity.

Edit: I didn't see the latest post as I was typing mine. Your snake isn't going to like, die if it doesn't have UVB. People add UVB, from what I understand, to allow their snakes to express more natural behaviors such as basking, which they don't do without UVB. I think the concept is that this helps mimic nature better and is better welfare for the snake to be able to express additional natural behaviors.