Retrofitting china cabinets?

[Bogertophis]

I will add that there are PLENTY of things I won't tackle, & that any confidence I had to tackle the projects I've described evolved gradually: from first buying unfinished furniture many years ago & finishing it myself (mostly to save $ over buying expensive "real wood" pieces, & being unwilling to waste any $ on cheap particle-board junk that falls apart), then being an animal-lover, I had to learn to build my own cage tops (wood & 'hardware cloth') for aquariums I used for small pets (rodents first, later snakes). Long before I got into snakes, I ended up with a pair of chipmunks* that I needed to build a huge cage for from scratch- it wasn't perfect but it served the purpose quite nicely, & with each thing you do, you learn more ways to do things. (*FYI, the chipmunks were NOT taken from the wild, & I was overseas when I acquired them, not in the U.S.- by some miracle of circumstances, I was able to bring them back with me, & they lived out their natural lives with me.)

When I got into keeping snakes, I found available "cages" to be less than ideal- & this was some years back, when snakes weren't common pets at all, so I found myself seeing existing furniture in new ways, to make it work as a framework for what I wanted. I am certainly no skilled carpenter- just willing to do what I can with a few tools, like a jigsaw & a drill. I know my limits too- when to out-source help, as I did with the cabinet doors that had glass windows.

Snagrio- If you're a total beginner with all of this, you're probably better off not trying to do this- I only answered because you started this thread, not trying to pull you into a project that's too much for you. Saying it "can" be done, isn't the same thing as saying "you should try it..." Okay? As Hugsplox pointed out, things don't always work quite the way you expected either, & then it's either "on to plan B" or giving up. I don't give up, lol. Not without a big fight but I research a lot first, & the more experience you have with a wide variety of materials & projects, the better.

[Bogertophis]

As far as finding the right furniture to "convert"- where I am, there is a local small furniture store that builds some of their own pieces, & also carries pieces from other sources. They can & will do custom work, for "a price" of course. One time when I was in there just looking, they had a huge oak wardrobe cabinet (6' tall, about 4' wide as I recall). It was very gently used- the customer bought it from this store originally, but later decided to move & this cabinet was super heavy, plus it didn't fit their new place, so they consigned it back to the store to re-sell. I vaguely remember the price was negotiable, asking around $400. It was beautiful, & quite tempting, but TOO big & heavy- I didn't want to deal with it either.

But yes, I could "see it" as a great snake home, with the right modifications. One thing I wondered though was about the natural finish- I don't trust any oil finishes to be safe around snakes, & I don't think a safe coating could have been applied to seal & waterproof that wood. (To clarify- the oil in the woodgrain would not have allowed such water-based finishes to "stick".) So that was one complication- I'd have much preferred pine, like "This End UP" type of furniture. I have bought a few pieces from them over the years- that sort of furniture (sturdy with straight lines) is much easier to modify.

Anyway, when it comes to keeping arboreal snakes, I'd suggest looking for unfinished (-preferably) "wardrobe" cabinets- that's the right size & shape. For anyone that's up to the task, anyway. Last but not least, make sure you have the time, the patience, & the space to work on such projects. Sometimes it's truly cheaper & best to just buy pre-made- we aren't all the same, nor are our circumstances. Pre-made may seem more expensive up-front, but it's ready to go, & doesn't carry the risk of not working out for whatever reasons, & wasting the materials that only frustrated you.

[Snagrio]

I'm getting war flashbacks to when I got that shoddy enclosure off of Craigslist. I also remember having a lot of arguments with my mother about my mother regarding why it wouldn't work (as good as she is with the construction end of things, she's not nearly as savvy when it comes to exotic pet stuff in regards to what's safe for them). Plus even just running rough calculations on what would be required with modifications and materials, there probably wouldn't be all that much money saved in the end compared to just getting a professional PVC build unless the cabinet was REALLY cheap, and we all know the adage of getting what you pay for...

I guess the question now goes back to, what in a general opinion is acceptable for an adult, 8-10' long VBBRS? I've heard 4'X2'X2' minimum but that sounds far too small for such a long and active animal. AP has a 6'X2'X4' that wouldn't completely break the bank even after upgrades, staying under a grand compared to just about every other PVC enclosure of a similar size elsewhere. Would that be a reasonable permanent size? Problem is though is that I'd have to place an order nearly the second I'd be financially about to, because my goodness the lead times are brutal.

[Bogertophis]

I'm getting war flashbacks to when I got that shoddy enclosure off of Craigslist. I also remember having a lot of arguments with my mother about my mother regarding why it wouldn't work (as good as she is with the construction end of things, she's not nearly as savvy when it comes to exotic pet stuff in regards to what's safe for them). Plus even just running rough calculations on what would be required with modifications and materials, there probably wouldn't be all that much money saved in the end compared to just getting a professional PVC build unless the cabinet was REALLY cheap, and we all know the adage of getting what you pay for...

I guess the question now goes back to, what in a general opinion is acceptable for an adult, 8-10' long VBBRS? I've heard 4'X2'X2' minimum but that sounds far too small for such a long and active animal. AP has a 6'X2'X4' that wouldn't completely break the bank even after upgrades, staying under a grand compared to just about every other PVC enclosure of a similar size elsewhere. Would that be a reasonable permanent size? Problem is though is that I'd have to place an order nearly the second I'd be financially about to, because my goodness the lead times are brutal.

I think the 6' tall x 4' wide x 2' deep would work just fine. 4'x2'x2'? No way I'd use that for an 8-10' snake , but it's going to take time to grow large- it won't need a huge home for quite a while.

Believe it or not, I've scored a few really nice wood furniture items in thrift stores, used, but which needed very minimal or nothing at all fixed. That's one thing I really like about the area I live in- there's quite a few good thrift stores, but naturally it takes luck & good timing to find the right thing when you need it. I think you're better off just saving for the right pre-built enclosure.

[Snagrio]

I think the 6' tall x 4' wide x 2' deep would work just fine. 4'x2'x2'? No way I'd use that for an 8-10' snake , but it's going to take time to grow large- it won't need a huge home for quite a while.

Believe it or not, I've scored a few really nice wood furniture items in thrift stores, used, but which needed very minimal or nothing at all fixed. That's one thing I really like about the area I live in- there's quite a few good thrift stores, but naturally it takes luck & good timing to find the right thing when you need it. I think you're better off just saving for the right pre-built enclosure.

That does beg the question. How fast do beauty snakes grow? While not Vietnamese blues you have had Taiwan beauties iirc, which is a close approximation.

[Bogertophis]

That does beg the question. How fast do beauty snakes grow? While not Vietnamese blues you have had Taiwan beauties iirc, which is a close approximation.

Like most things, snakes grow faster when they're young in order to survive predators, & they reproduce a.s.a.p. in the wild ("survival of the species"). Their rate of digestion/growth is temperature dependent so in captivity, with plenty of food, & no brumation, they'll get pretty big in about 2 years, but not maximum size for a while yet. As adults, their growth slows down some the older they get. You might ask those breeding VBBs for an estimation. But I would guess you'd have time to save for & order the adult-size home- assuming you have enough self-control to save $-? Not everyone does. The smaller enclosure (4x2x2) would be good for starters, & if well-taken care of, you could sell it when your snake needs the upgrade in a couple years. Not saying to wait until the last minute though to get on the "wait" list, but at least you'd be able to re-coup some $ from the first enclosure, that is, if you don't fill it again!

[Snagrio]

Like most things, snakes grow faster when they're young in order to survive predators, & they reproduce a.s.a.p. in the wild ("survival of the species"). Their rate of digestion/growth is temperature dependent so in captivity, with plenty of food, & no brumation, they'll get pretty big in about 2 years, but not maximum size for a while yet. As adults, their growth slows down some the older they get. You might ask those breeding VBBs for an estimation. But I would guess you'd have time to save for & order the adult-size home- assuming you have enough self-control to save $-? Not everyone does. The smaller enclosure (4x2x2) would be good for starters, & if well-taken care of, you could sell it when your snake needs the upgrade.

I don't actually have a 4'X2'X2', that was a hypothetical "what people said" thing. More than likely it'll be in a big sterlite tub before anything else since that's what's recommended for quarantine process (though a taller one than what my BP is in currently).

As for self-control, not having income for a while has instilled that quite deeply in my habits so I should be good. Though speaking of which to go slightly off-topic, I got confirmation that I landed that pet walking/sitting job just a few minutes ago, so my plans can for sure proceed. Huzzah!

[Bogertophis]

I don't actually have a 4'X2'X2', that was a hypothetical "what people said" thing. More than likely it'll be in a big sterlite tub before anything else since that's what's recommended for quarantine process (though a taller one than what my BP is in currently).

As for self-control, not having income for a while has instilled that quite deeply in my habits so I should be good. Though speaking of which to go slightly off-topic, I got confirmation that I landed that pet walking/sitting job just a few minutes ago, so my plans can for sure proceed. Huzzah!

Yes, I know you don't already have the 4x2x2- just saying, it might work best to buy that first, then plan to upgrade in about 2 years.

'Grats on the new job.

[Snagrio]

Yes, I know you don't already have the 4x2x2- just saying, it might work best to buy that first, then plan to upgrade in about 2 years.

'Grats on the new job.

Ah, but then like you said I'll just be tempted to fill it with something else. After all, would be a shame to leave such a nice enclosure just sitting there empty. In other words, there's a reason my mother "encouraged" me to sell the 55 gallon tank I had lying around.

And thanks.

[Bogertophis]

Ah, but then like you said I'll just be tempted to fill it with something else....

It's a very common affliction around here, believe me. It's taken me several decades to finally be able to ignore an empty tank. (Your mother knows you very well.)