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  1. #1
    BPnet Veteran Snagrio's Avatar
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    Retrofitting china cabinets?

    Been thinking about it for future species (namely a blue beauty), and I've noticed that when it comes to PVC enclosures I always seem to run into an issue of them not being long enough, or tall enough since VBBRS like some arboreal opportunities. And any that offer sufficient length and height often have very lofty prices of over a grand.

    And then I thought of folks that utilize china cabinets as snake enclosures which in theory would (should I find one suitable) provide both dimensions while not breaking the bank. Plus I'd undoubtedly be able to get such a setup up and running at a far more reasonable time compared to the multiple months a lot of PVC companies take to make and ship these days (5 months in waiting for the T10 I ordered for my BP for example and probably another 5 to go with how everything's been delayed). Obviously there are extra factors to consider like modifications (sealants, vents, wiring, ect.) and finding one made out of safe wood that doesn't have dangerous oils and/or chemical treatments, but I'm curious if others here have tried this method and would love to hear of any successes and challenges involved.

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    Bogertophis's Avatar
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    I did exactly this many years ago, for my Taiwan Beauty rat snake. I know I've described it in at least one thread here, but off-hand I don't recall which one. Might try a search?
    It worked great, incidentally. No time att to give details, but will get back to it when I can.
    Rudeness is the weak man's imitation of strength.
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  4. #3
    BPnet Veteran Snagrio's Avatar
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    Re: Retrofitting china cabinets?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bogertophis View Post
    I did exactly this many years ago, for my Taiwan Beauty rat snake. I know I've described it in at least one thread here, but off-hand I don't recall which one. Might try a search?
    It worked great, incidentally. No time att to give details, but will get back to it when I can.
    Gave it an honest try with multiple keywords but I couldn't find a thread of yours involving a cabinet enclosure.

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    Bogertophis's Avatar
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    Re: Retrofitting china cabinets?

    Quote Originally Posted by Snagrio View Post
    Gave it an honest try with multiple keywords but I couldn't find a thread of yours involving a cabinet enclosure.
    I didn't start the thread, just posted about what I've done in a discussion of DIY / furniture conversions.
    Rudeness is the weak man's imitation of strength.
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  6. #5
    BPnet Veteran Snagrio's Avatar
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    Re: Retrofitting china cabinets?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bogertophis View Post
    I didn't start the thread, just posted about what I've done in a discussion of DIY / furniture conversions.
    Even looked for general keywords (cabinet, enclosure and whatnot) and no luck. Ah well.

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    BPnet Veteran Hugsplox's Avatar
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    Re: Retrofitting china cabinets?

    I don't see why this wouldn't work. Seen a few set ups for differen't species of lizard done in old china cabinets. The only thing I would say is pay attention to the original paint/stain used if you get a really old cabinet. The safety standards weren't really there back in the day lol, would probably be best to do some really good clean up and sanding, then reseal the entire thing.

    You've probably already done so, but if you just google something like "bearded dragon china cabinet enclosure" there are a few great examples of what you can do.

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  9. #7
    Bogertophis's Avatar
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    Re: Retrofitting china cabinets?

    Quote Originally Posted by Snagrio View Post
    Even looked for general keywords (cabinet, enclosure and whatnot) and no luck. Ah well.
    I don't find that our "search" feature works all that well for me either, fwiw.

    Anyway- there's a great deal of variation in furniture, so it's pretty much impossible to give detailed instructions. As already mentioned, pay BIG attention to safety for your pets when it comes to finishes that may have been used.

    In MY case, I bought a large & very sturdy UN-finished solid wood open adjustable-shelf multi-purpose cabinet many years ago. Since I originally finished it, it has been reincarnated several times now: it once held stereo & books/misc., but when I got into keeping snakes, I saw how easily I could enclose the back (with thin, fancy plywood) & sides (using sheets of perforated metal- sold in hardware/home improvement stores) for the sides to give excellent cross-ventilation, & also made optional lightweight wood covers (out of extra scraps from the "back") to block/reduce the ventilation in winter). The perforated metal is really cool- just make sure to install the "rough side" facing outward, so the snake won't abrade their nose if they happen to rub on it.

    The hinged top lifts up & allows access to a recessed light fixture that the snake cannot touch- it's blocked with metal mesh screening. I had double front-doors professionally made & installed- they have 2/3 glass "windows" & my skilled cabinet guy installed them beautifully with piano hinges. I also got help with installing an actual 'home' thermostat, connected to a heat cable that I installed about a foot up from the floor, parallel to the floor & encircling the sides & back- not the front, because the doors had to open- & it worked perfectly! The floor was designed to be cooler & since heat rises, it went according to plan. BTW, this was many years ago- I couldn't have bought a thermostat like most of you are now using if I'd wanted to, lol- but fyi, the ones used on houses can work just fine. In case you're wondering, this vertical cabinet housed a very happy Taiwan Beauty rat snake.

    I haven't bought any unfinished furniture in years, nor priced any- I'm quite sure that the prices have gone up considerably, but considering that you can get exactly what you want, then finish it using snake-safe products without having the mess of stripping old finished off, I think it's probably still worth it. Oh, and I installed good casters on the bottom of this cabinet too, so it's easy to move.

    I mentioned back at the beginning that this cabinet has been "reincarnated" more than once. It eventually became a really nice china cabinet (& still is), lined with fancy brocade* fabric but I'll spare you all the details. (*There was a local store that bought up all sorts of drapes & shades that were returned to JCPenny & re-sold them very cheaply- that's where I got the fabrics- just took a few matching Roman shades apart, for about $2 apiece.) It's so much fun being creative, & I've often cruised thru "thrift stores" with an eye for good cabinets (solid wood, NOT particle-board crappola) that I might re-purpose. Real wood may cost more to start with, but it doesn't fall apart in a couple years like the cheap stuff does- it's worth it.

    The cabinet I've been describing was NOT my only make-over, btw. On a few other cabinets, I installed sliding NON-overlapping glass doors** on the front- they slid in aluminum tracks that I installed, & locked securely using a simple metal peg inserted into a hole drilled in the wood cabinet on either side, & past which they couldn't be moved.) You could also have a handyman or under-employed (retired?) cabinet-maker build something exactly to your specs if you like, if you're not adventurous enough to build your own, & save some money by only doing the finishing touches. Like I said, it's FUN. (Remember to water-proof everything for snakes- with non-toxic NO VOC products.) **The local glass shop can make exactly what you need in tempered glass with rounded edges.
    Last edited by Bogertophis; 09-20-2021 at 05:17 PM.
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  11. #8
    BPnet Veteran Snagrio's Avatar
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    Re: Retrofitting china cabinets?

    I imagine you can also make a little less work for yourself if you find one with certain "features" already built in? Like glass doors that can easily have a lock attached and such? Another thing is substrate. Most china cabinets don't have a bottom lip so would one have to build in a little "ledge" to keep it from falling out every time you open the enclosure? I'm also curious how sealing works. Is it just sealing the edges and corners or are the entire inner walls of the cabinet coated?
    Last edited by Bogertophis; 09-20-2021 at 07:24 PM.

  12. #9
    Bogertophis's Avatar
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    Re: Retrofitting china cabinets?

    Quote Originally Posted by Snagrio View Post
    I imagine you can also make a little less work for yourself if you find one with certain "features" already built in? Like glass doors that can easily have a lock attached and such? Another thing is substrate. Most china cabinets don't have a bottom lip so would one have to build in a little "ledge" to keep it from falling out every time you open the enclosure? I'm also curious how sealing works. Is it just sealing the edges and corners or are the entire inner walls of the cabinet coated?
    Sure, by all means look for features that work for you, OR, pieces that lend themselves to what you need.

    Tempered glass sliders are fairly cheap- it's just glass, but much more to have wood doors with glass windows.

    Installing a "ledge" would be easy enough to restrain substrate.

    But all wood (even assuming stained & finished) is NOT waterproof until YOU make it so, & that's the challenge. Ever leave a damp glass on furniture? So if this cabinet will be very moist or frequently so, you'd be better off lining the bottom with something* & sealing all the edges. (like with something used for countertops-showers-flooring-or even plexi/PVC, etc.) As with aquariums, corners can be sealed with aquarium silicone sealant- non-toxic when fully dried & cured. (It takes a LONG time to cure if you put it on too thick- be warned.) Sealing out moisture also seals out mold & pathogens that like to move into surfaces weakened by moisture- you'd want to coat ALL interior surfaces- you'll be sorry if you don't. There's other products that I've heard of also, but never worked with that you might consider using- (as I would, if I was doing another cabinet right now)- it's made to seal ponds & is fish-safe- I pulled this up real quick to point you in the right direction- https://pondwiki.com/pond-sealer-and-paint/ Such products that are safe for fish will be safe for herps too.
    Last edited by Bogertophis; 09-20-2021 at 07:31 PM.
    Rudeness is the weak man's imitation of strength.
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  13. #10
    BPnet Veteran Snagrio's Avatar
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    Re: Retrofitting china cabinets?

    Quote Originally Posted by Bogertophis View Post
    Sure, by all means look for features that work for you, OR, pieces that lend themselves to what you need.

    Tempered glass sliders are fairly cheap- it's just glass, but much more to have wood doors with glass windows.

    Installing a "ledge" would be easy enough to restrain substrate.

    But all wood (even assuming stained & finished) is NOT waterproof until YOU make it so, & that's the challenge. Ever leave a damp glass on furniture? So if this cabinet will be very moist or frequently so, you'd be better off lining the bottom with something* & sealing all the edges. (like with something used for countertops-showers-flooring-or even plexi/PVC, etc.) As with aquariums, corners can be sealed with aquarium silicone sealant- non-toxic when fully dried & cured. (It takes a LONG time to cure if you put it on too thick- be warned.) Sealing out moisture also seals out mold & pathogens that like to move into surfaces weakened by moisture- you'd want to coat ALL interior surfaces- you'll be sorry if you don't.
    I'm guessing I simply use a sealant trowel to get a smooth even coating over the whole inner enclosure? And while I have an idea as to what wood types are safe, idk how I'd be able to tell what a cabinet was made of if there isn't a label, let alone if the wood was treated with anything potentially harmful. Any tips for that? Another thing is ventilation. Would something like circular sawing small slits on the back/sides be sufficient or would I need to be more intricate?

    As an aside, did I accidentally leave a swear in my last message or something? I noticed you edited it and I'm not sure if I did something wrong?

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