Dark Axanthic PLUS Pied breeding outcomes?

[Python_lover13]

Hello!

Recently I've gotten extremely into ball pythons! I've had my pied ball python for almost a year now and she's growing quickly!

I want to eventually breed her with an axanthic morph. My goal is a mostly black/white/grey pied like the one below:

Now, my question is, if I get an axanthic ball python that is more brown and darker in color, is there still a chance it will come out like the one below? Or should I look specifically to get a more silver/white/grey axanthic ball python? I can't find an answer anywhere and any help would be appreciated!

Thank you!!

[Lord Sorril]

Hello!

Recently I've gotten extremely into ball pythons! I've had my pied ball python for almost a year now and she's growing quickly!

Greetings! Is your pied ball python Het for a specific axanthic (e.g. SK or VPI)?

I want to eventually breed her with an axanthic morph. My goal is a mostly black/white/grey pied like the one below:

Breeding a straight up Axanthic to a Pied will produce 100% Hets which will then need to be intercrossed when they mature to get a 1/16 chance of producing an Axanthic Pied. You can get animals that are Het Axanthic: such as a Pied Male Het for SK Axanthic, and a Pied Female Het for SK Axanthic and cross them together, and then your odds will be 1/4 instead. Again, make sure your Hets are the same type of Axanthic.

Now, my question is, if I get an axanthic ball python that is more brown and darker in color, is there still a chance it will come out like the one below? Or should I look specifically to get a more silver/white/grey axanthic ball python? I can't find an answer anywhere and any help would be appreciated!

Brown Axanthics (with no additional morphs present) are ones that lack and/or have lost their silver color to some extent (usually as they have aged)...they are less desirable. Background genetics are a factor and you should be looking for the most silver you can find in a line bred specimen.

[nikkubus]

You could possible introduce different shades from your female, but it's a lot better idea to pick up an axanthic that already has the tones you want to produce for the best outcome.

As a brand new breeder, I would caution against breeding pied to axanthic. Normals and normals het something are extremely difficult to sell, especially if you don't have an established name. My very first year breeding I ended up only selling one normal het and had to keep feeding and housing the rest for a long time, which is expensive. Some suggestions:

Find a male axanthic het pied with a nice incomplete dominant or two. Later on when you are more established, you could breed him to multiple females. It's a big investment, and it may take some time to even find available, but it will pay off. I'm just going to use a firefly axanthic het pied as an example, but you could use practically any incomplete dominant morphs.
Firefly Axanthic het Pied x Pied:
-1/8 Firefly Pied het Axanthic
-1/8 Fire Pied het Axanthic
-1/8 Pastel Pied het Axanthic
-1/8 Normal het Axanthic
-1/8 Firefly het Axanthic Pied
-1/8 Fire het Axanthic Pied
-1/8 Pastel het Axanthic Pied
-1/8 Normal het Axanthic Pied
See how those results are worlds more desirable? Only 1/8 will be normal double het. Then you can take one of the nicest pied females and put her back to the dad and have much better odds second generation getting your axanthic pied (1/4).

Do some research into the line of Axanthic you want to work with and stick to that line. TSK Axanthic is not compatible with VPI Axanthic, so you can't breed them together and get Axanthic. VPI is by far the most common, so it will be easier to find more. However, one of the top Axanthic breeders, JD Constrictors, uses TSK, so if you are a fan of his and want to work with his line, TSK it is. Really get a feel for what morphs are available in each line, how they look, and plan ahead. You will kick yourself later if you don't.

I'm not trying to discourage you from your project, but another option would be to find a powerhouse male with a bunch of incomplete dominants, maybe even some supers, and no Axanthic at all, and breed that to your pied to get your feet wet. Double recessive projects are not an easy place to start, and can take a really, really long time to get anywhere. Then when you finally do hit your Axanthic Pied, it takes a bunch more years to add anything new into the mix and hit whatever morph + Axanthic Pied again. Having some projects with just incomplete dominants, or a single recessive morph and incomplete dominants is going to be a lot easier and faster to build on, and a lot cheaper. It's nice to have some projects going that are helping support your hobby, turning out animals that sell easy and well, while you are waiting for things to happen with a double recessive project.

If you haven't even researched to the point of understanding what we are talking about with recessives and incomplete dominants, you definitely have some homework to do, and I would do that before purchasing any male. Males can mature pretty quickly, so I wouldn't put any kind of rush purchasing one. Instead, save up money, figure out some solid plans, and purchase one when you have really nailed down what male you want to start with.

Best of luck and feel free to ask more questions!