My Ball Python tested positive for Nidovirus

[Bogertophis]

You know I read a story and an exchange between a buyer and big breeder a year or so ago. I'll leave the breeder's name off of this because this was an alleged situation and I don't know how true it is. Buyer picked up a handful of snakes from the breeder, over time found that they had nido, reached out to the breeder, didn't have a good experience, and took to forums/FB to comment on the situation.

Two things happened as a result of this. One, the breeder got involved and began displaying some pretty poor customer service, and two and more importantly, the fans of this big breeder started attacking the buyer on his posts. Of course all the responses weren't an attack on the buyer, but there was a lot of blame shifting, excuses, alternate theories, etc etc.

I do think if you have a bad experience with a breeder you should let the community know, but at the same time I understand why some people might be hesitant to do so based on situations like that one.

I remember that "hot mess", & much of this seems to come down to how much is not yet known about Nido, & how to interpret tests done. New snakes are under so much stress (shipping & whole new environment) & that naturally lowers the ability of their immune system to function well. This goes back to what I always tell people when they get a new snake of any age: treat it like a patient in ICU (intensive care unit in the hospital) or like a newborn human baby for a while- it needs rest & good food, with a low-stress environment & optimal conditions, while it's body recovers from all it has been exposed to. I can see where even if breeders test for Nido, the snakes they ship out could have tested negative for it & potentially then later, under stress, test positive for it. What a nightmare for everyone.

[Hugsplox]

I remember that "hot mess", & much of this seems to come down to how much is not yet known about Nido, & how to interpret tests done. New snakes are under so much stress (shipping & whole new environment) & that naturally lowers the ability of their immune system to function well. This goes back to what I always tell people when they get a new snake of any age: treat it like a patient in ICU (intensive care unit in the hospital) or like a newborn human baby for a while- it needs rest & good food, with a low-stress environment & optimal conditions, while it's body recovers from all it has been exposed to. I can see where even if breeders test for Nido, the snakes they ship out could have tested negative for it & potentially then later, under stress, test positive for it. What a nightmare for everyone.

Exactly. This is actually one of the issues we had at my company when we started talking about bringing people back into the office prior to the covid vaccine being widely available. The concern was we could have employees test negative before coming back, but testing negative today doesn't mean you don't get exposed tomorrow. There's just no guarantee that if I test my stock monthly or whatever, that someone still won't get a sick snake. There's also those people who might have it in snakes they already own, and try to blame the breeder of a new snake they just got, when in reality it was already in their collection. Taking advantage of the lack of information.

Hopefully though as the hobby continues to gain popularity we'll learn more. Kinda like parvovirus in dogs, we identified that what in the 70s? Now we have decontamination methods and vaccines.

[Bogertophis]

Exactly. This is actually one of the issues we had at my company when we started talking about bringing people back into the office prior to the covid vaccine being widely available. The concern was we could have employees test negative before coming back, but testing negative today doesn't mean you don't get exposed tomorrow. There's just no guarantee that if I test my stock monthly or whatever, that someone still won't get a sick snake. There's also those people who might have it in snakes they already own, and try to blame the breeder of a new snake they just got, when in reality it was already in their collection. Taking advantage of the lack of information.

Hopefully though as the hobby continues to gain popularity we'll learn more. Kinda like parvovirus in dogs, we identified that what in the 70s? Now we have decontamination methods and vaccines.

Funny you mention the similarity to the COVID situation, as they mentioned that too, in the video shared (post #8), when it comes to tests that are negative but later show positive, etc. Lots more research is needed & in the meantime, we need to be careful about finger-pointing & let the science sort this out.

[WildCreations]

I have just gone through the same thing. Bought 2 ball pyhtons in December and in January they started showing signs of an RI so brought then to my reptile vet and nothing seemed to shift it so we sent off swabs and while waiting for them to come back my albino female passed away and once I got the result I has to bring in my pied female to be euthanized. Broke my heart. I had never heard about it before and its the most horrendous thing when you read about it.

What we’re the symptoms you saw from the ones that had to be euthanized??

[SnKReptiles]

Looked just like an RI. Open mouth breathing, bubbling in the mouth. She even took a meal towards the end cause she looked to be getting better but when I got the results my vet said their is no cure and there will be lesions all over her body inside and will only get worse so kindest thing was to put her down.

[Bogertophis]

Looked just like an RI. Open mouth breathing, bubbling in the mouth. She even took a meal towards the end cause she looked to be getting better but when I got the results my vet said their is no cure and there will be lesions all over her body inside and will only get worse so kindest thing was to put her down.

I'm so sorry for your loss & for her suffering. RI's are not rare, especially among BPs- so this should scare anyone with a snake that exhibits the symptoms of an RI, especially when you have more than one snake & knowing this is contagious. The takeaway is to get your snake tested for Nido if they show signs of an RI- and to practice good quarantine (for a long enough time!) when adding any new snakes to one's collection- no matter how "reliable" the source. Nido is a horrible disease- thank you for sharing your experience here to raise awareness.

[SnKReptiles]

Ya I got her off a very highly recommended place. You just never know. Thankfully I was lucky and the rest of my collection didn't get it because I quarantined. Its so important.

[Albert Clark]

Wow, thanks to asplundi for giving the open door to this virus (nido) through the discussion with Travis and DVM Dale Porcher. A wealth of information that we all as keepers need to know. We really have to stay on top of our husbandry and quarantine practices is what I get out of this. Always being watchful and careful for signs of illness and inappetance in our collections. Thanks again asplundi!

[Malum Argenteum]

I'm glad this thread got bumped, since that linked discussion is fantastic. Here's a link to the podcast version:

https://soundcloud.com/theherpetocul...dr-porcher-dvm

Good to hear that RAL is recommended by Dr. Porcher. I've been using their services and this makes me feel even more secure in doing so.

[Albert Clark]

Thanks MA. Definitely will take a listen to it. I’ve already taken a page out of this topic and incorporated new cleaning and disinfecting practices. Thanks again