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  1. #11
    Bogertophis's Avatar
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    Re: Usark- new alerts!

    Quote Originally Posted by Hugsplox View Post
    Its funny that you say that, I'm by no means a conspiracy theorist, but I often wonder when a big news story breaks and runs for a few weeks and then just vanishes, what laws got passed without anyone paying attention. Obviously Covid isn't a conspiracy, but same principle. Can lawmakers institute changes like this while their voters are focused on other things, scary to think about.

    As far as the Eureka deal, that seems way over the top. I mean the NY ban was a big deal and I thought that it was outrageous, but this one seems targeted like they have a purpose in mind they're not talking about. What harm could having a ton of feeders possibly have? I've got probably thousands of dubias sitting behind me, safe in their bins, and I promise none of my neighbors know or care about them.
    As to the first part- it's been apparently happening, actually- legislation after distractions ("look over there!") but I don't want to get into politics here...it's not a "conspiracy" theory either, just more of an observation- putting 2 & 2 together. It's why we always need to pay attention to news. I know I haven't always done so either, certainly not when I was working full-time- between work & all my animals, news wasn't my focus, exhaustion was, lol. I know better now. It also might not be about passing a law, but in some cases distracting from a scandal.

    Feeders of all kinds...I agree, who cares? I don't understand where any of that is coming from. I just truly hope they can get it stopped. I used to raise my own mealworms too, when I kept geckos...gosh, that could be a big-time crime now, eh?
    Rudeness is the weak man's imitation of strength.
    Eric Hoffer (1902 - 1983)

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  3. #12
    BPnet Veteran Hugsplox's Avatar
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    Re: Usark- new alerts!

    Quote Originally Posted by Bogertophis View Post
    I used to raise my own mealworms too, when I kept geckos...gosh, that could be a big-time crime now, eh?
    Oh I know it, you can breed mealworms on a massive scale with next to no space. Am I gonna get the door kicked in for my poor beetles?

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    Bogertophis (03-05-2021)

  5. #13
    Registered User Zombie2019!'s Avatar
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    Re: Usark- new alerts!

    I hope it doesn't HIT GA cause they will have to kill me before they take my child away from me. I will fight to keep zombie.

    Sent from my SM-G973U using Tapatalk

  6. #14
    BPnet Veteran WrongPython's Avatar
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    Re: Usark- new alerts!

    Normally I tend to keep to myself regarding reptile policy thoughts, but I think there are actually some interesting public policy things to learn here for those who may be interested.

    Regarding Eureka: this policy action is an overall updating of city animal ordinances. It sounds as though this is just for the City of Eureka proper -- and not the overall Eureka metro area -- so I imagine the proposed bans and caps are designed with the hope of keeping nuisance-level animal situations from developing within the city, like animal hoarding. The overall tone of the proposals strike me as more of a "no annoyingly large animals or collections, please!" type of thing versus animal rights/"you shouldn't be allowed to keep that EVER!" Livestock bans within city limits are actually pretty common, so seeing that isn't a surprise. The overall "large animal" ban -- which includes the giant snakes and crocodilians -- isn't much of a surprise either. Large animals and their maintenance tend to present more of a nuisance in dense(r) cities than they do in the country. As for the insect thing, I wouldn't be surprised if they were just lumped in with everything else, and that city council folk would be open to changing their minds after talking with people. Again, this sounds like this is just a case of local government updating ordinances to keep up with the times and prevent nuisances, and not them trying to step on peoples' rights.

    Regarding all the other stuff: I get the impression that all of these travelling animal show and animal shipping bans stem from Tiger King. In officials' to limit the big cat/related exotics trade, other species have inadvertently been caught up. Travelling animal show regulations are probably designed to stop mobile cub petting operations and circuses with sub-par husbandry, while animal shipping bans probably want to stem the trade of big cats. In many cases, the initial drafts of laws are unknowingly written too broadly, since lawmakers are not normally subject matter experts in what they're attempting to regulate. This is why legislative bodies often have their own research support bodies, seek public comment on proposed laws, listen to various lobby groups, etc. Making good policy takes time, and in the vast majority of cases, spur-of-the-moment and first attempts don't meet muster and end up dying. A lot of policy proposals can be described as good intentions, but poor execution.
    0.1 Sonoran Boa sigma​: "Adelita" ('19 Hypo het. leopard)
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    Bogertophis (03-05-2021)

  8. #15
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    I'll admit I'm not familiar with Eureka & I hope you're right [WrongPython] about these new rules being just for the city proper -but I don't really know that, one way or another. If true, certainly I'd agree that horses & other livestock have no place living in town. But there's a lot more there to be concerned about, & it's all too easy for those who don't like snakes & other reptiles (etc) to push for a ban when they're already in the majority & reptile-keepers in the minority.

    Also, as far as banning animal shipping & traveling, if that stands it also prevents someone like me from taking (non-native?) snakes to give a local requested snake education program, either to a classroom or to a local fair (as I've done for years). I'm not in that area affected, but just explaining why we'd be concerned if these kinds of laws keep passing.
    Last edited by Bogertophis; 03-05-2021 at 06:54 PM.
    Rudeness is the weak man's imitation of strength.
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    WrongPython (03-05-2021)

  10. #16
    BPnet Veteran WrongPython's Avatar
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    Re: Usark- new alerts!

    Yes, the "slippery slope" of bans is definitely something to be mindful of. Within the realm of reptiles, it's not just people who just don't like herps who may try to take advantage of this, but larger animal rights groups as well. I personally think the former will be less of a problem over time - as more and more people keep reptiles, they're starting to become mainstream pets, and (hopefully) less controversial. In a couple decades, the people who "just don't like herps" and want them banned from their neighborhood may be viewed on par with people who "just don't like dogs" or "just don't like cats" and would like a similar ban (yes, said people exist). Animal rights groups, on the other hand, probably won't be going away, and are the likely to be the greatest political thorn in pet owners of all stripes' sides.

    I'm not totally familiar with the New York shipping ban, but those certainly sound like activities it would (likely accidentally) outlaw. In theory, even similarly innocent things such as trailering your horse to a horse show or non-local vet/farrier could be as well. This is why speaking up and contacting your lawmakers is so important - they may not realize the consequences of the policies they've proposed and quickly change their minds when enough constituents disapprove!

    For those who would like to start participating and weighing in on the reptile-related policy-making process (beyond supporting USARK), Clint's Reptiles just put out a great video ("Can We Save The Reptile Hobby?") on the subject that I highly recommend! For those who may be hesitant about being politically active, remember that even the little things can help. Show people how reptiles are a beloved member of your family (like any other pet), be a good ambassador for the hobby, and welcome those who wish to join us! All those little acts can add up
    0.1 Sonoran Boa sigma​: "Adelita" ('19 Hypo het. leopard)
    1.0 Boa imperator longicauda: "Kuzco" ('19 het. anery)
    0.1 West Papuan Morelia spilota​: "Pandora" ('20)

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    Bogertophis (03-05-2021),Hugsplox (03-05-2021)

  12. #17
    BPnet Veteran Snagrio's Avatar
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    Re: Usark- new alerts!

    Quote Originally Posted by Bogertophis View Post
    Time for a call or an email, I guess. Many times these things get passed "under the radar" when everyone's distracted by other things...like, oh you know, a pandemic or something. They might even try to half-heartedly blame the animals FOR the pandemic? I hope they get this stopped & sorted out, it makes no sense.
    As I've said before, that's exactly what they're doing in a roundabout way (a common reasoning for many of these new law proposals are via the guise of "future pandemic prevention"). I won't go into details as it'd go far too deep into politics, but this rampantly amped up war on animal ownership is but one of many incredibly insidious operations our governments have been up to for the past year as they take full advantage of the public's gullible and easily distracted attention during this never-ending virus fiasco.

    Never let a crisis go to waste...

  13. #18
    Reptile Dysfunction
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    Does anyone have an update on this? Did the bill pass?
    Checkout my YouTube channel! I post Ball Python Morph Combo videos daily: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXr...7cOR5pcCONzvtA

  14. #19
    BPnet Veteran WrongPython's Avatar
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    Re: Usark- new alerts!

    Which bill, might I ask?

    The USARK website main page and their Facebook post updates on the legislation they're following. If there's been any movement on the bill in question, there will probably be an update there.
    0.1 Sonoran Boa sigma​: "Adelita" ('19 Hypo het. leopard)
    1.0 Boa imperator longicauda: "Kuzco" ('19 het. anery)
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  15. #20
    BPnet Veteran Spicey's Avatar
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    Re: Usark- new alerts!

    Quote Originally Posted by WrongPython View Post
    A lot of policy proposals can be described as good intentions, but poor execution.
    And it's the execution that comes around to bite us all in the rear.
    "Something Clever"

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