Rosy boa and Kenyan sand boa breeding

[Cheesenugget]

I never give much thought to breeding my snakes until I started keeping a rosy myself. They are so underrated and so cool! One of the requirements I was told is that they have to brumate during the winter months to breed successfully.

I live in South FL. We either get a few weeks of the cold and the rest is rain and hot sun. Dropping my temps below 75 is a challenge. I have heard of people using wine coolers to help brumate their snakes, but that seems so scary. What if I accidentally froze them to death? We don't have basements here so can'tove the cage anywhere in the house that would meet brumation temps.

So my question is it possible to breed rosy's without chilling them? Even if she ends up with small litters, I'm fine with that as long as it won't hurt the female, and it's more of a hobby breeding for me than making money.

Oh same question to Kenyan sand boas too. I heard that they don't need to brumate to breed, is that true?

[Bogertophis]

I can't speak for sand boas, but when I bred rosy boas, I did not brumate them & my older (!) female had big & ALL healthy litters every year (5 out of 6 years- I didn't let her breed one year, trying to get her to retire, but she wouldn't listen, lol.) FYI, I did not WANT to breed this snake at ALL- she was old AND a rescue from a museum- the only reason I did finally pair her up was because the first year I took her in & got her weight back up to where it should have been, she produced parthenogenically!- a deformed live baby that lived 8 mos. & a bunch of slugs that nearly killed her to push out.

She had very poor muscle tone from years of underfeeding & stress (not warm enough to digest!) in the museum, & from her age- understand that live neonate snakes are FAR easier for the "mom" to expel...they pretty much come out on their own. Whereas pushing out slugs is exhausting. I had to tube-feed her for a while afterwards, wasn't sure she'd make it. BTW, she lived to age 26 if the museum was correct in their records as to when they got her; she was mine for the last 11 years of her life, & because she had plentiful food & TLC, the 5 years of producing nearly 50 healthy neonates in all didn't seem to faze her at all. Those were NOT her last years- she lived years beyond that, happily.

You might just turn off their heat (gradually & withhold food) for a couple months in winter, as they tend to refuse food anyway then. I have brumated other snakes (like corns) but not the rosies- apparently it wasn't needed. Those snakes I did brumate never went below 50* by the way- you're correct that you must avoid freezing them! In the wild, about 5' below ground I've read that it stays about 50-60*, & that's where snakes try to brumate -below ground where the temps. stay fairly constant. They can survive lower but why push it? That's where I brumated my snakes too, 50-60*. As it gets above 55*, they tend to wake up more. Where I brumated my snakes then was in an outer-wall closet, & near the floor where it's cooler; in the high desert, we did get some cold temps in winter.

If you're still thinking that lowering the temperatures (safely) would be best, what I'd suggest to make it cooler in her cage is to fill 4 plastic bottles of water & freeze them. Put one in each of their enclosures for 12 hours, & then exchange them with frozen ones & refreeze the first 2. (Also cover their enclosures to darken them.) No way I'd "refrigerate" snakes...nor put them in a very cold garage. Also, keep their water bowls filled- they aren't sound asleep & may drink now & then while snoozing.

Kenyon sand boas are from such a hot climate, I can't imagine them really needing brumation if rosy boas don't? But that's just my guess...

[Cheesenugget]

I can't speak for sand boas, but when I bred rosy boas, I did not brumate them & my older (!) female had big & ALL healthy litters every year (5 out of 6 years- I didn't let her breed one year, trying to get her to retire, but she wouldn't listen, lol.) FYI, I did not WANT to breed this snake at ALL- she was old AND a rescue from a museum- the only reason I did finally pair her up was because the first year I took her in & got her weight back up to where it should have been, she produced parthenogenically!- a deformed live baby that lived 8 mos. & a bunch of slugs that nearly killed her to push out.

She had very poor muscle tone from years of underfeeding & stress (not warm enough to digest!) in the museum, & from her age- understand that live neonate snakes are FAR easier for the "mom" to expel...they pretty much come out on their own. Whereas pushing out slugs is exhausting. I had to tube-feed her for a while afterwards, wasn't sure she'd make it. BTW, she lived to age 26 if the museum was correct in their records as to when they got her; she was mine for the last 11 years of her life, & because she had plentiful food & TLC, the 5 years of producing nearly 50 healthy neonates in all didn't seem to faze her at all. Those were NOT her last years- she lived years beyond that, happily.

You might just turn off their heat (gradually & withhold food) for a couple months in winter, as they tend to refuse food anyway then. I have brumated other snakes (like corns) but not the rosies- apparently it wasn't needed. Those snakes I did brumate never went below 50* by the way- you're correct that you must avoid freezing them! In the wild, about 5' below ground I've read that it stays about 50-60*, & that's where snakes try to brumate -below ground where the temps. stay fairly constant. They can survive lower but why push it? That's where I brumated my snakes too, 50-60*. As it gets above 55*, they tend to wake up more. Where I brumated my snakes then was in an outer-wall closet, & near the floor where it's cooler; in the high desert, we did get some cold temps in winter.

If you're still thinking that lowering the temperatures (safely) would be best, what I'd suggest to make it cooler in her cage is to fill 4 plastic bottles of water & freeze them. Put one in each of their enclosures for 12 hours, & then exchange them with frozen ones & refreeze the first 2. (Also cover their enclosures to darken them.) No way I'd "refrigerate" snakes...nor put them in a very cold garage. Also, keep their water bowls filled- they aren't sound asleep & may drink now & then while snoozing.

Kenyon sand boas are from such a hot climate, I can't imagine them really needing brumation if rosy boas don't? But that's just my guess...

Yea I heard for KSB, you throw them together and they do their business. No brumation, that's how easy it's supposed to be. For rosy, I hear the opposite - don't bother brumate corns but chill those rosy's! If I were to breed corns, I don't think I would have brumate them, mostly because we have corns here in the wild, we never get that cold year round and they do just fine making babies. But I will give it a try with my rosy not brumating her once she is old enough and in good weight! She's still a tiny noodle. She is from the Dulzura locality and I noticed finding another Dulzura may be difficult. Do I have to breed the same locality together, even though they are the same species? Most buyers seem to care about the designer morphs more than where it originated from.

[Bogertophis]

If you have an unusual location, then for best demand for the offspring I think you'd be better off finding a mate that "matches". The rosies I've kept were first, Mexican rosy boas (I had one pair of them- the chocolate & cream) & then local high desert intergrades. For breeding purposes, they'll all breed, just less certainty the outcome appearance. When I lived in the high desert there was a fair amount of variation- some showed much more coastal influence, others more desert (straight & defined stripes), some had more orange-rust color, & some brownish stripes. If you just like rosy boas, as I do, I love them all. And my "intergrades" were very vigorous- strong feeders. Nothing like the one time I bred the obviously inbred* Mexican rosy boas (*the source had assured me they weren't siblings but I didn't believe that once I bred them- the offspring were wimpy & I ended up selling the adult pair as pets. I like snakes that are survivors- what nature intends.

[Spicey]

I'd always assumed that KSB's didn't need to brumate since their original climate is on the equator. I don't plan on breeding mine anyway since he is a pet, but that hasn't stopped him from looking for love in the spring (2nd year now). At least I'm not freaking out this year and wasting mice. The demind for them seems to have slowed anyway, since you can get a decent '20 KSB for $80 on Morphmarket.