L. leonis youngster is not eating

[shelpen]

Greetings fellow kings keepers!
I got a very young Nuevo Leon king a 1.5 - 2 months ago and I cannot get him to eat consistently.
He ate 3 times but every time it’s a major drama: he is very (!) flighty and fast thus impossible to persuade to eat in the enclosure. So I put him into a smaller one for feeding — after much persuasion he took a pinky.
Not without hissing/musking/tail rattling though.
Amd it’s very inconsistent - what worked the last 2 times didn’t work tonight at all.
A rather strange feeding response from a king, don’t you think?
Any advice?

He is 12” 11g
Currently resides in 12x10x4 (8L) clear plastic box, on aspen, has a hide and a branch w/leaves to hide
No dedicated heat but the reptile room is 78/day and 65/night

[Craiga 01453]

Leave him in his enclosure. Moving is likely stressing him and causing the refusals.

Think of it like this...they live in a big wide world and find their food. They can find it inside their enclosure.

How are you offering? How often? Offering too often can also lead to refusals.

[shelpen]

Leave him in his enclosure. Moving is likely stressing him and causing the refusals.

Think of it like this...they live in a big wide world and find their food. They can find it inside their enclosure.

How are you offering? How often? Offering too often can also lead to refusals.

Offering F/T every 5 days

Agree on stressful situation with a separate box
but
I’m positive he will not find the prey item on his own. Haven’t tried though. Hmmm... Nothing to lose...

[Craiga 01453]

Offering F/T every 5 days

Agree on stressful situation with a separate box
but
I’m positive he will not find the prey item on his own. Haven’t tried though. Hmmm... Nothing to lose...

Trust me, Kings are fantastic hunters. I've got about 15 years experience keeping Kings. If there's one thing they do know it's how to eat.

[shelpen]

Trust me, Kings are fantastic hunters. I've got about 15 years experience keeping Kings. If there's one thing they do know it's how to eat.

I will try this tomorrow night!

May I also ask —
do you think he needs a dedicated heat source? My MB and FL kings are excellent eaters without any but who knows, maybe this particular shoelace of a snake needs to be warmer?

[Craiga 01453]

[QUOTE=shelpen;2719179]I will try this tomorrow night!

May I also ask —
do you think he needs a dedicated heat source? My MB and FL kings are excellent eaters without any but who knows, maybe this particular shoelace of a snake needs to be warmer?[/QUOT

Sorry, I just saw where you listed the temps. I wouldn't let it drop that low if it were me. I'd keep it above 70 and see if that helps too.

[shelpen]

What are your temps?

Will work on keeping the temp up a bit at night. Shouldn’t be difficult.
I let it dip into the high/mid 60 for the cresteds but steady 70 will not upset them, I’m sure.

Thank you so much!
I will give it a week or so and come back to report.

[dakski]

I agree with Craig here.

Also, he needs a heatsource.

Even a small UTH for now regulated by thermostat to about 86F (craig - does that sound correct for a kingsnake? Anyone else?).

70F at night is fine as long as he has a warm spot to digest. I would be worried about regurge without a heat source. Most colubrids like a warm spot to digest, but will often spend time on the cool side (however most people keep the cool side 72-78F). What's important is that he can digest properly and there is a range of temps so he can choose. My corn snakes are 84-86F hot side and 75-78F cool side depending on the time of year. Room temp would be fine for a cool side if it didn't get below 70F or so.

Also, are you offering F/T prey on tongs and proper size prey?

Show him or put it near him if you can see him and then leave it. He will find it. You can also leave it and him alone and he will probably find and eat.

I would adjust temps though.

Be cognizant that he is not a crestie by any stretch. Read up on kingsnakes and what they need and provide that. Never make an assumption about one animal because of another. Different species can have very different requirements.

Good luck and keep us posted.

[Craiga 01453]

Yes dakski, you're spot on. I aim for 86 with my King and low to mid 70s cool side.

But having that hot spot to digest is very important. Kings have a pretty quick metabolism but without that hot spot digestion will be difficult and regurges won't be uncommon.

[dakski]

Yes dakski, you're spot on. I aim for 86 with my King and low to mid 70s cool side.

But having that hot spot to digest is very important. Kings have a pretty quick metabolism but without that hot spot digestion will be difficult and regurges won't be uncommon.

Thanks Craig. I learned the hard way with Figment. When I first got him, I had his hot spot at 88-90F like a BP and the rest at room temp. He regurged once. Hot spot too hot and cool spot too cold. That was enough for me when he was 5 months old and all of 11G. I didn't feed for a few weeks and did my homework. That's what motivated me to really study reptiles and the individual species I have. Took me a while before I was comfortable writing a post like the one here on temps etc. for kingsnakes. Small mistakes, that my pets have survived, have made me a better reptile keeper. It also taught me to know what I am getting into first. Yes, I have 13 reptiles, but I have a lot of redundancy (7 species, 8 if you count the Rhacodactylus separately, but they have virtually the same environmental requirements), so I can keep track of their environments pretty well.

I made a lot of mistakes as a kid in the 80's and early 90's. I vowed never to do it again and to help others. However, the information and the venue(s), like BP.net weren't around until much later in my herping life and it took a while to figure out who to trust.

I was talking with Don Soderberg at South Mountain Reptiles when I got Solana from him. He said, early on, he lost a lot of snakes (1970's and 1980's) in order to figure out what was best and to be an authority. He told me, "Learn from my mistakes, I owe it to them to educate and prevent the same with other keepers."

I try to preach the same here. Again, any mistakes I've made with current animals and losses as an adult herper (RIP GEORGE), where small, and in George's case, he was pretty darn old for a Beardie (not a mistake either).

If I can help limit others' to small mistakes, I have done my job here.

Remember, everyone, you can always learn more. Always. Be humble and open minded, but stand strong if you are confident in something based in fact or experience. We are in it for the love and care of the animals, not for our own edification.