My baby ball python died.... anybody know why?

[BV2]

Hey guys my 4month old ball python died two days ago suddenly. I am a first time owner and I’m curious as to what might have happened to him.


Before he passed when everything seemed normal to me I had got back from an errand with him and he pooped and peed while we were out the first time he did it was Fine but as I took him to wipe him I noticed he had watery brown poop all over himself. When we got back home I put it in It’s terrarium on his favorite rock humidity 60-70ish and temperature between 80-85. It just rolls over on its backside as if it needed Help flipping over. I then picked it up And laid it in Properly and instead of it going into his favorite rock he just stayed in front of it on the substrate. I thought everything was normal as he didn’t show any symptoms of anything. I left the room for about 15minutes to eat. I came back and he had a mouth full of substrate and was rolling his head back, I looked up “the wobble” and it seemed similar to what he was doin except he looked like he had it worse, his top head was literally almost touching his back.


My boyfriend then picked it up And it stopped. I immediately got as much dirty out as I could. I also took it to The bathroom to the sink in a little cooler than Luke warm water let him sit in it hoping to get the rest of the little bit it had left in its mouth. It seemed Fine for a little bit but when I took it out And set him down his neck would be a different direction from his body. Then all of a sudden his head would flop back he did it about twice this whole time I was looking up what could have caused this and all I got was wobble and corkscrew. He didn’t show any of the symptoms but the neck roll and that was the first time he’s ever done it. I’ve never caught him stargazing or anything He are fine once skipped a week of eating but after that it was Okay. But anyway I then took him from the bathroom into my room laid him on his back to see if he would flip on his own, he didn’t. He was so still not stiff but as like he had no energy or interest in moving. He would slither a little bit normally and he hadn’t did the head movement all night after that.


I was kinda worried as if I knew something was going to happen but when this all started it was Already too late to take him to the vet. I sat with him kinda as if i didn’t want him to die alone. I set him on my lap crying because it was My first reptile and I loved him so much. He began to start curling up kind of awkwardly so I put him down and he laid there for about 3-5 minutes. It was Time for me to go to sleep so I put him in his favorite rock even then I knew something was wrong because he usually curls up in the corner he just laid out in it . The next morning at 8am I was going to take him to the vet but when I open the rock he passed already. He was stomach side up in an awkward position loosely curled up with his head under him my boyfriend picked him up and he had a liquid spot under his head somewhat like gooey but it was Very little.


I took him to petco and fortunately they had gave me another one and disposed of the other. I was kind of feeling bitter sweet because how can I just replace him like that , especially that quick. But loving to be able to take a new snake in.

[Craiga 01453]

I'm so sorry to hear of your loss.

Unfortunately, this is why we advocate so strongly to avoid the big box pet stores and buy from a reputable breeder.

It doesn't seem to me that you did anything that could have caused the animals passing.
I certainly don't think this the reason the snake passed, but snakes aren't social animals and aren't the type of pet you take on errands. Please do your new snake a favor and leave your pet at home. There is literally ZERO benefit to taking your snake on errands.

Unfortunately, you'll probably want to forget anything you learned from the big box store employees as well. They're usually minimally trained and clueless on keeping snakes. Of course, there are exceptions to every rule, but this usually the case.

I wish you the best with your new snake.

[BV2]

I'm so sorry to hear of your loss.

Unfortunately, this is why we advocate so strongly to avoid the big box pet stores and buy from a reputable breeder.

It doesn't seem to me that you did anything that could have caused the animals passing.
I certainly don't think this the reason the snake passed, but snakes aren't social animals and aren't the type of pet you take on errands. Please do your new snake a favor and leave your pet at home. There is literally ZERO benefit to taking your snake on errands.

Unfortunately, you'll probably want to forget anything you learned from the big box store employees as well. They're usually minimally trained and clueless on keeping snakes. Of course, there are exceptions to every rule, but this usually the case.

I wish you the best with your new snake.

Any explanation about the head roll? And how is gettin a snake from the pet store different from reputable breeder. And I will try to insert a picture of how it was Laying

[jmcrook]

And how is gettin a snake from the pet store different from reputable breeder

Similar to buying a bike at Walmart vs buying a bike at a bike shop. Walmart does not hire bike mechanics, their bikes are of poor quality with low grade parts, often incorrectly assembled, and can offer little if any assistance when a tune up or repair is needed. Sure, they may have employees that have some mechanical knowledge of bicycles, but that is not their top priority when hiring folks.
To make a broad generalization, Petco/Petsmart/PetSuppliesPlus/etc are basically Walmart in this analogy. A reputable breeder/reptile specialist pet store will be far better equipped to offer tips on husbandry and also intuitively be able to assess the health and well being of the animals they are selling.

[Craiga 01453]

Any explanation about the head roll? And how is gettin a snake from the pet store different from reputable breeder. And I will try to insert a picture of how it was Laying

I honestly don't know enough about the head roll. It sounds neurological to me, but that's little more than an educated guess.

As for the difference, reputable breeders breed from select stock to breed better animals genetically. They also provide better care for the animals prior to selling them.

The animals from the big box stores are basically bred in "puppy Mills" with little attention paid to genetics, health or care before selling the animals.

The stores themselves typically provide horrible care for the animals as well. Their husbandry is usually way off, they underfeed, etc...

Don't get me wrong, some animals from the big box stores live long, healthy lives. But more often than not when we hear about an animal suddenly dying young like that, it came from a store and not a breeder.

Considering these are living creatures who will live in our care for 20+ years, it's worth doing some research and buying from a reputable breeder.

[pretends2bnormal]

Agreed, sounds like a neurological issue. Wobble is a specific neurological issue tied to genetics, so unless your snake was a spider or one of the other wobble morphs, it was not actually wobble. (And most spiders do not present nearly that sort of wobble without additional stressors or health issues potentially caused or exacerbated by many I list below)

None of us can see your snake nor know for sure without a substantial amount of additional info, but here are some possibilities you can consider looking into. Many should be easy to rule out, but confirming one could be impossible...

Most commonly neuro issues are caused by either heat or chemicals in some form.

Heat, such as unregulated heat lamps or heat mats, can cause it. As can using a dimmer to control the heat and the house heating up during the day while no one is home to see it or light from a window baking them through the greenhouse effect. Especially an issue in glass tanks since the extra glass layer will magnify it more than a tub.

Alternatively is chemical. Most people are good about thinking of not spraying bug killers near their snake's cage, but there are a lot of possibilities besides that. Most commonly unknown is scented candles in the room or plug in air fresheners or smoking/vaping. Those chemicals and smoke can do some major damage to snakes. Along those lines are products like febreeze, failure to fully rinse off cage decor when washed with bleach (residual vapor), or even non-label use of things like reptile mite sprays.

On top of that, rodents can be treated with pesticides for mites and other issues (including antibiotics) which if not allowed to exit their system before being frozen or fed off live will harm the snake and can present various symptoms including neurological as well. Many medications for rodents have multi-month periods to exit the system and a disreputable rodent vendor could be a potential culprit. (Or pesticides sprayed at a pet store that got onto a rat you bought.... etc.)

Sent from my SM-G950U using Tapatalk

[Craiga 01453]

Random, but as far as adding a pic, many of us use the free app Tapatalk to upload pics.

[Bogertophis]

I am very sorry for your loss. There really isn't any way we can tell you for sure what went wrong, but one possible thing stands out to me. You said you took him with you on errands, and like any other pet in hot weather, they are best left home as our cars (or just being outside) can cause them to over-heat & die from a heat stroke. A snake that's over-heated might well show neurological symptoms just as yours did.

On the other hand, his passing may have been a coincidence & he might have died from an illness that he had when you got him. Pet stores are risky places for buying snakes, as their animals come from various places, & all that exposure means they have a greater risk of catching diseases from other animals, as well as mites, which can spread diseases among them.

Unless you had a necropsy done (& right away) there's no way to be sure what went wrong, but in the future, if you MUST take your snake in the car (like for moving or to a vet), the safe way for them to travel is first in a secured snake bag or pillow-case they cannot escape from, & then the bagged snake is placed in a styro-foam shipping box (like food or snakes are air-shipped in) or in an insulated "cooler". Sun coming thru car windows can over-heat pets quickly & cause injury & death. So can just having them outside on days that are too hot, or for too long in the sun. In the wild, snakes go underground where it's cooler to escape the heat of the day. In my town there was a guy who used to like to show off by walking around with his boa on his shoulders...until his poor boa died of a heat stroke. I learned about it from the vet. It's unfortunate that snakes cannot tell us they're uncomfortable...it's up to us to KNOW what they need.

So listen: while I think it's very possible that your snake was killed accidentally from being over-heated, I'm not telling you this to make you feel guilty, but so that you learn from your mistake, & even if he died from some other cause, it's important that you don't make this mistake at some point in the future, with another pet. That's why we have a forum, to share what works & what's harmful, to prevent as many accidents as we can so we don't all have to learn the "hard way". Again, I'm sorry for your loss.

[Bogertophis]

And by the way, getting another snake so quickly after one dies of unknown causes (some of which may be both communicable & deadly) is not a good move
on your part, BV2. If this second snake (as referred to in the thread https://ball-pythons.net/forums/show...90-Snake-mites) came from the same
shop AND has mites, those are both health risks, besides whatever 'germs' may still be lingering from your first pet that passed away. It would have been safer
to wait a while before acquiring another snake, & personally, I'd not likely have bought from the same place.

[BV2]

And by the way, getting another snake so quickly after one dies of unknown causes (some of which may be both communicable & deadly) is not a good move
on your part, BV2. If this second snake (as referred to in the thread https://ball-pythons.net/forums/show...90-Snake-mites) came from the same
shop AND has mites, those are both health risks, besides whatever 'germs' may still be lingering from your first pet that passed away. It would have been safer
to wait a while before acquiring another snake, & personally, I'd not likely have bought from the same place.

For 1 if you would’ve read my thread I said they GAVE it to Me I didn’t “get” it
and 2 everything I had from the other snake was thoroughly cleaned out.