new interest in snakes, trying to learn.

[JRLongton]

With that said, if you want to breed ball pythons, check out Olympus Reptiles video on breeding. If I recall correctly, he mentioned the start up costs can be about $10k if you want to do this seriously and correctly. It is not for someone who wants to dabble into lightly.

I love Olympus! He has a number of videos specifically about starting up a breeding business/program. Lots of good information. But the thing that I really like about those guys is how much they love the animals and the hobby. They are nothing but effusive.

I've also heard nothing but bad things about both Underground Reptiles and BHB. I used to watch Brian Barczyk's you tube videos, but quickly gravitated elsewhere.

[Skyrivers]

Even as a rookie I know mountains more than you and I have barely scratched the surface. Bad feelings about your attitude to people trying to help you and be advocates for the animals. Where is Debrah when you need her. Let her get in here. Perhaps if you hear words of caution from experts you might hear a few of the things we have been telling you.

[MissterDog]

Do know that a lot of breeders don't end up making much or any money back. A lot of them just lose money by becoming breeders.

I definetly recommend getting a baby BP and when it's old enough to breed then make your decision.

You say you love animals so much, but also consider would you have the heart to cull deformed snakes or pre-kill your own rats for picky eaters? This is why I would have a hard time being a breeder.

This. OP also keep in mind, ball python hatchlings will almost always require being fed live for their first meal (or more) before you can make a switch to f/t. This transition won't always be easy and you WILL encounter a few babies who will take more time or refuse to switch at the timeframe you want.

I'm also hoping Deborah will chime in with the harder questions and reality checks to help you determine if breeding really is for you vs falling in love with the concept of it. If you want any solid advice from someone who is very reputable and greatly experienced in the hobby, it will be from her hands down.

[artgecko]

As an addendum to my first response, and based on some other things you've posted, I'll note some points for you to consider below.

1. My reference to 3-4 week feeding schedules was a reference to adult (over 4-5 years) boas as boa constrictors (BCC and BCI) require less frequent meals to avoid becoming obese, which can cause an early death. Most species need weekly or bi-weekly feedings as adults (I have most of my adult BPs, carpet, BRB, etc. on every 10 days -14 days).

2. As a total beginner with reptiles, you should pick a species suitable for being a beginner...That is not to say that you wouldn't be able to keep a more difficult species, but it is harder to meet their specific requirements. Most require very strict humidity, temps, housing, or feeding and in some cases temperament plays a role. A species like a GTP has very specific humidity and temp needs, they can stress easily, they are very fragile as babies, and can be difficult to reproduce. That is why they are often classed as an advanced species.. It is not that a beginner can't meet their requirements, but if you slip up on temps or humidity, the animal could go down hill much faster than a hardier animal. Also note that if you see GTPs listed for cheap they are almost certainly wild caught animals which come with their own host of issues..everything from getting them to feed, to treating internal / external parasites. I would under no circumstances start with a WC animal as a beginner.. Heck, even I won't keep a WC animal and I've been keeping for ~15 years now. If you like the look of GTP, you may want to consider carpet pythons. Jungles in particular don't get large and are known to be pretty hardy. They climb and can perch similar to GTP and are related, but not as hard to keep. They still have a temperment that is less trusting and more bitey as neonates, but will usually tame down when worked with gently. Note that biting isn't necessarily bad because it can hurt you, but it can cause additional stress on the animal and they can also break teeth off, which can become infected and require care.

As a side note here, the more information you can get the better.. There is a great youtube channel run by a guy that owns a reptile shop in the UK called "Snakes N Adders" he has classified reptiles into beginner, intermediate, and advanced classes and done youtube videos showing them and talking about their care. I highly respect him and think he gives accurate info. I will link his youtube page here. Note that he takes this so seriously that he will not sell an intermediate or advanced animal to a person new to the hobby.

I would again state that you need to find a species that you really want to keep as a pet and dig into the care of that particular species..Make it your goal to learn everything you can about them before you even make your first purchase. After making that purchase, you will learn many things through trial and error, but you should focus on perfecting your care of that lone animal first. When you can successfully keep that animal healthy, growing, etc. then it'll be time to look into buying your second animal. There are also some great books out there with information on different species. I will list some here...Most are available on Amazon, ebay, or other sites. These have info on care, on natural habitat, disease, breeding, morphs, localities, etc.

The Complete Chondro
The Complete Carpet Python
The Complete Boa Constrictor
The Complete Ball Python

3. Do not buy your animals from a dealer (like BHB or Underground)... As a beginner, you want to buy from an established, but smaller, breeder that can give you personal help should you need it and one that has a solid reputation in the hobby for that particular species. If your end goal is possibly breeding, the animal you select should be from a source that is reliable..meaning that if they tell you it is an "x" that it is actually an "x" and not something else. If you want to keep a species with morphs, some of these can be harder to tell apart and animals can get sold as the wrong morph (on purpose or not) if your species has sub species or localities (i.e. Nicaraguan boas, boc constrictor longicauda, BCC, etc.) then you need to find a breeder that specializes in localities and has documentation on his animals... that way you know you aren't buying a "mutt" labled as something else.

This also has the benefit of helping you sell future offspring because buying from a known breeder with good lines and being able to say "the mother is from breeder "x"'s line of this particular morph" goes a long way. Quality also is always a good thing.. People in the hobby for a species know what a quality animal is and is not and if you are selling poor quality animals, no one will want to buy. If you should decide this hobby isn't for you and you need to sell that first female you purchase, it will be easier to do so if you have documentation on who she's from, what she is, etc.

Note that some of the people who authored the books I posted above still breed and are very well known and reliable. If you end up with an interest in carpets, for example, Nick Mutton runs Inland Reptile and has some of best carpet pythons around. Vin Russo is still breeding boas at cutting edge. There are smaller breeders that are very well known in their species communities also (i.e. Jeff Holloway, Scott Miller, and Warren Treacher in Kenyan sand boa community) getting involved in the community will help you find out who is and is not a reliable breeder and who you may want to buy from.. Knowing the lingo the community uses (morph names, locality names, etc.) before inquiring about purchases is always good too and getting involved and doing research first is the only way to make that happen.

4. Feeding: f/t feeders are gassed via CO2. If you absolutely can't take feeding live, you need to get a well-established baby or juvenile that the breeder is dead certain takes f/t like a champ.. Even so, you can still get an animal that was taking f/t reliably and has decided that it won't any more. With breeding, you never know. Most breeders start out with at least one live feeding. Some babies will switch, some won't, and you have to be able to provide what that animal needs. Unless you have a local feeder breeder that can sell live pinkies, fuzzies, or hoppers, that may mean raising your own. It's no fun, but I have had to gas my own feeders and rats with deformaties or health issues.

5. Laws- I don't live in FL, but do know you need a license to sell there (can't remember what permit or licesne is called) you even need one if you are selling your ex pet on CL as FL FW has done sting operations to catch those without. I'd assume anything non-venomous would be OK, but some species I know need permits and chipping. Your city / county may have additional laws, so check with local animal control or government people.

All that said, when you've figured out which species you might be interested in, let us know and I'm sure people can give you more specific info at that point. Good luck with your research.

[smoothnobody]

Do know that a lot of breeders don't end up making much or any money back. A lot of them just lose money by becoming breeders.
how do breeders lose money? this seems like a rather unlikely situation. equipment and animals are a one time cost. recurring costs of feed electric and maintenance is minimal. i can see if you are going big and renting commercial property you can go down the toilet but that's not my goal. i just want to do this for myself and make a little extra on the side.

You say you love animals so much, but also consider would you have the heart to cull deformed snakes or pre-kill your own rats for picky eaters? This is why I would have a hard time being a breeder.
to give you an answer if i could kill rats i would have to know how it's done. if it's with nitrogen i could do it. if it's by slamming them against a wall i couldn't do it. i understand some animals are fussy and won't eat pre-kill but almost all of these established companies have their animals eating frozen. even with my limited knowledge i know it's rare for a ball not to eat frozen. why do people kill deformed snakes?

[smoothnobody]

I know there are those four and even five figure animals out there.
not my goal to produce five figure animals. 500-900 an egg would be my goal.


In order to produce those few with highly desirable traits, you would need to maintain a fairly large number of animals, meaning anywhere from 30 (at a base minimum) to hundreds.
not my goal to have hundreds of animals and produce new morphs. i'm not trying to compete with big breeders. 3 animals is enough for now.

That's just the cost side of the equation. Then there's the upkeep and maintenance, the real snake keeping. How do you feel about spending your days cleaning poop, scrubbing water bowels, and occasionally getting bitten?
​maintenance seems pretty easy. feed once a week at the most. replace dirty paper once a month or buy a bioactive terrarium and let nature do it's thing. tell me what i am missing here. i already mentioned my cat probably does more damage to my hand than a ball will. nobody wants to get bit but it's not a too scary to handle situation for me.

[redshepherd]

"how do breeders lose money? this seems like a rather unlikely situation. equipment and animals are a one time cost. recurring costs of feed electric and maintenance is minimal. i can see if you are going big and renting commercial property you can go down the toilet but that's not my goal. i just want to do this for myself and make a little extra on the side."

Actually if you're just starting out and add all expenses including snake cost, feeding them, at best you break even with your expenses. It takes quite a few years (if you raise from hatchling) and a few years even more before you might earn extra on top of the total cost. And this is if you are breeding higher-end morphs.
It also depends a lot on building a reputation and having a buyer base. Otherwise you may have 10~20 hatchlings, assuming you get two females, that you must feed and raise for maybe half a year or more.

why do people kill deformed snakes?

You need to cull snakes that are deformed or ill to the point of not being able to live normal lives.

[smoothnobody]

Even as a rookie I know mountains more than you and I have barely scratched the surface. Bad feelings about your attitude to people trying to help you and be advocates for the animals. Where is Debrah when you need her. Let her get in here. Perhaps if you hear words of caution from experts you might hear a few of the things we have been telling you.

kinda surprised with this response. i didn't question if you knew more than me. you made a cute comment about sending me a bill. i gave you a cute response. you are misreading the situation, badly. the smiley face right next to my comment was a huge hint it was meant playfully.

[smoothnobody]

keep in mind, ball python hatchlings will almost always require being fed live for their first meal (or more) before you can make a switch to f/t. This transition won't always be easy and you WILL encounter a few babies who will take more time or refuse to switch at the timeframe you want.

this i know, i've heard and watched videos of live pinky feedings. i feel less guilty about this cause their eyes aren't even open yet. they are kinda ignorant and helpless. i assume they don't know fear like an adult would.

[Skyrivers]

kinda surprised with this response. i didn't question if you knew more than me. you made a cute comment about sending me a bill. i gave you a cute response. you are misreading the situation, badly. the smiley face right next to my comment was a huge hint it was meant playfully.

That was not me. I just see your approach as fail. Best of luck.

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