Probe Placement spin-off

[MissterDog]

Kinda sad this thread got derailed to the point only 1 out of the 5 pages are about the original topic.

[SquirmyPug]

Same difference. RHP or HEAT TAPE the probe placement counts.. species doesn’t matter, its the point of how it can be effected. But go ahead and be a wise guy. Ive been doing this for 30 years and seen it all and your wrong. But thats ok too.. just unfortunate if anything was to happen to a animal/reptile.

Gotta love it. Newbie questions 3 weeks ago now telling others whats safe...


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Care to explain how it can be effected? Of course placement matters. Species also matters and the fact we've been talking about UTHs.

I haven't been a wise guy, infact I've been nice about everything including people saying things are wrong or that animals are going to get hurt.

Whether anyone wants to admit it, a probe inside the enclosure above the UTH is nearly identical to having the probe between the enclosure and UTH.

If you want to talk about something dangerous, how about all the people controlling entire racks with heat tape with a single thermostat? What happens if the thermostat has a problem? You cook all the snakes in the rack?

I see far more dangerous stuff done with everyone's animals than having a probe inside the enclosure.

[CALM Pythons]

Care to explain how it can be effected? Of course placement matters. Species also matters and the fact we've been talking about UTHs.

I haven't been a wise guy, infact I've been nice about everything including people saying things are wrong or that animals are going to get hurt.

Whether anyone wants to admit it, a probe inside the enclosure above the UTH is nearly identical to having the probe between the enclosure and UTH.

If you want to talk about something dangerous, how about all the people controlling entire racks with heat tape with a single thermostat? What happens if the thermostat has a problem? You cook all the snakes in the rack?

I see far more dangerous stuff done with everyone's animals than having a probe inside the enclosure.

I don’t want to beat a dead horse. The great thing about this country is that I can tell you your wrong and you can disagree and Vice Versa.
Im sorry to the OP as we have hijacked this thread over beginners Husbandry.
Its simple, I will not admit anything as you say “ Whether anyone wants to admit it, a probe inside the enclosure above the UTH is nearly identical to having the probe between the enclosure and UTH.”
Thats plain not true. We’ve explained the difference and you do not agree which is fine.... the probe can be affected by substrate, moisture, the reptile itself etc etc etc....bottom line its not good practice or safe practice.
You wanted to point out heat tape and Thermostats in a rack having a problem and cooking the rack.. wrong again. If you look into what long time Herpers are using here it will 90% of the time be either 2 Thermostats or a Thermostat that contains safety’s. I use Herpstats and not the “Basics or EZ’s”. I use Herp 2’s that contain not only a alarm but also a shut off to problemed channels if something occurs. Having a cold reptile instead of a over heated reptile is the lesser evil any day. Home temps are ok until you notice the problem. This is why we dont recommend the cheap Pet Store Tstats. Do some people use them, yes... does that mean its the safest, NO.
So lets stop going around in circles about common sense safety that has been practiced for decades now.
If you want to debate and pick at each other their is Sub Forum area so that we don’t disrespect people and their Threads.
Open up a thread in there and as I have time this winter I’ll argue with you here and there when I sit down and have a Drink


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[Skyrivers]

You do wonderful. I lived in Germany for 3 years. Loved everything but the winter.

Yup, I'm German

When I get tired or stressed I seem to loose my English sometimes, LOL. So don't pay attention to spelling or grammar, please..

[Craiga 01453]

Care to explain how it can be effected?

There are already PAGES explaining why. Youre just too set in your ways to learn something.

You've clearly got a lot to learn, but you keep doing you. Keep ignoring the 50+years of experience in this thread alone telling you the probe is safer outside the enclosure.
Your couple of months experience are clearly more reliable than ALL of us.

[zina10]

Perhaps part of the problem is that these Zilla thermostats have huge probes. At least they used to back when I used one many years ago. They are so big and round they would lift a big part of the UTH away from the tank of you would put it between the tank and the UTH.
Back then I put the probe under the UTH and under that would be a sheet of 1 inch Styrofoam that the tank sat on. I made a small indentation into the Styrofoam so that the probe had space but was still firmly touching the UTH without going anywhere. And everything stayed level despite the big probe. The weight of the tank kept everything in place nicely. The probe was also taped in place.
Don't know if I'm explaining that well..


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[pretends2bnormal]

Perhaps part of the problem is that these Zilla thermostats have huge probes. At least they used to back when I used one many years ago. They are so big and round they would lift a big part of the UTH away from the tank of you would put it between the tank and the UTH.
Back then I put the probe under the UTH and under that would be a sheet of 1 inch Styrofoam that the tank sat on. I made a small indentation into the Styrofoam so that the probe had space but was still firmly touching the UTH without going anywhere. And everything stayed level despite the big probe. The weight of the tank kept everything in place nicely. The probe was also taped in place.
Don't know if I'm explaining that well..


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The Zilla ones do still have the huge probes, at least the one I bought last year (before I had heard about the Herpstat brand) had a giant probe.

I do that exact same thing with the probe when I use it for QT tubs using 1/2" foam I had on hand and find it works just as well that way.

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[Stewart_Reptiles]

The reason not to put a thermostat probe in the enclosure have been cited NUMEROUS time, not only in this thread but it’s all over this forum as well (search function is your friend)

But I will recap anyway since apparently some people seem to just want to dismiss simple facts.

Inside the enclosure the probe can

• Be dislodged
• Peed on
• Submerged by spilled water bowl

All of which will lead the probe to cool down all of which will lead the temps to spike up and become dangerous.

When placed outside of the enclosure none of this can happen.

Anyone that has not had a snake pee large amounts or spill his water bowl over has simply not owned enough snakes for long enough time.

It’s basically common sense, also apparently not that common for some.

And for anyone that is new to this and still wonders, I will say this, when following advice make sure you follow the advice of EXPERIENCED and knowledgeable keepers, would someone owning a snake or two for a few months qualifies as experienced an knowledgeable, well I will let you be judge of that .

And while experimenting around is encouraged it should not be at the expense of animals especially when potential issues are well known.

And I will finish with this because it looks appropriate once again, you can lead a horse to the water but can’t make it drink.

[Craiga 01453]

The reason not to put a thermostat probe in the enclosure have been cited NUMEROUS time, not only in this thread but it’s all over this forum as well (search function is your friend)

But I will recap anyway since apparently some people seem to just want to dismiss simple facts.

Inside the enclosure the probe can

• Be dislodged
• Peed on
• Submerged by spilled water bowl

All of which will lead the probe to cool down all of which will lead the temps to spike up and become dangerous.

When placed outside of the enclosure none of this can happen.

Anyone that has not had a snake pee large amounts or spill his water bowl over has simply not owned enough snakes for long enough time.

It’s basically common sense, also apparently not that common for some.

And for anyone that is new to this and still wonders, I will say this, when following advice make sure you follow the advice of EXPERIENCED and knowledgeable keepers, would someone owning a snake or two for a few months qualifies as experienced an knowledgeable, well I will let you be judge of that .

And while experimenting around is encouraged it should not be at the expense of animals especially when potential issues are well known.

And I will finish with this because it looks appropriate once again, you can lead a horse to the water but can’t make it drink.

Thank you, Deb.

Squirmy, when one of the most respected people in this entire industry is trying to educate you, do yourself a favor and listen.
Deb doesn't comment all that often, but when she does, you can take what she says to the bank. She knows her stuff. Learn from her, your snake will appreciate it.

[MattEvans]

Just to go back over a few things op has stated. Air flow cools damp substrates at a much faster rate then dry substrate. So the fact that the snakes urine comes out at a snakes body temperature is moot, because that alone can cause a wet thermostat probe to read a lower temperature then the surrounding area. Second you said a snake laying over a thermostat probe has the same insulation of substrate as one mounted between the tank and uth is also incorrect. A snake with any substantial mass brings its body temptature with it.
An 80 degree snake laying on top of thermostat probe set for 90 is going throw off incorrectly regulated temperatures untill the the snakes temperature reaches 90 degrees. With the probe under the tank it touches the uth directly. Meaning that even if your snake is 80 degrees lying right on the glass above a mat set for 90, the temperature of your snake will rise at a slower and steadier rate never ever reaching above 90.