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  1. #1
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    Weird Brooks Kingsnake Poop?

    I'm very worried for my kingsnake, I've had him for about a year and suddenly this weird poop happened, I think he's in shed now and I tried to feed him as well, and he spit it out after the tail was almost down, now he's refusing to eat after a week of no eating, will he be okay????

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    Many if not most snakes don't want to eat during their shed: many start refusing well before the oncoming shed is noticeable to us, others refuse only while in
    "blue". The snakes that eat during shed are actually doing what is NOT normal in the wild. One reason is that their vision is worse than usual, so they are at
    greater risk from predators as well as their prey: an awkward strike at a rat can mean the rat injures or kills the snakes, and those snakes that have made this
    mistake have mostly been culled out by "natural selection" in the wild. Another reason most snakes instinctively don't want food during shed is that both digestion
    and shedding tax their bodies hydration: extra moisture is secreted between old & new layers of skin to help the old skin shed off, & digestion requires good
    hydration to complete as well (water is actually more important to a snake than food...that's important to remember if you ever take in a rescue in bad shape,
    you don't rush to feed them even though they are starving- re-hydration has to come first, before food.)

    So your snake is IN shed now...and he refused for the week prior? Perfectly NORMAL. Also, not seeing your snake but there is also such a thing as over-feeding-
    without knowing how much he eats, how often, & his size, it's hard to be sure, but as far as I can tell, this is nothing to worry about at all. Stop trying to feed a
    snake that shows any signs of going into shed, or trying to feed one that's in blue; wait until they get the "job" of shedding done, then offer food. That is when
    they would go looking for food in the wild...not during their shed.

    I cannot really tell what's going on with your snake's urates...I agree they don't look normal*, but knowing how voracious most king snakes are, I am wondering
    if he might have ingested a bit of his old shed or a piece of paper towel (accidentally while trying to eat?). I'd wait & see, after his shed, see if he eats, & how
    he's acting (normal?), and then see what "comes out the other end". If it's still weird, post it here or take it fresh to your herp vet to see what's going on...OK?

    *is this a captive bred snake or wild caught? That also could be internal parasites going on...you might take this fresh stuff a.s.a.p. to a vet for a check. (While
    any snakes can have parasites, w/c king snakes are usually heavily parasitized...they can be de-wormed safely and SHOULD be for the sake of their health; please see a good herp vet if this is the case?)
    Last edited by Bogertophis; 11-04-2018 at 09:02 PM.

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    Re: Weird Brooks Kingsnake Poop?

    Thank you so much for the wonderful information, and thank you for responding. My kingsnake is not wild caught, and is a beautiful hypo white sided brooks, 100% captive bred. He has been acting normal besides not eating and the weird poop. He has had problems eating before, an example would be striking, constricting for an hour, and then letting go and acting like the food isn't even there, but he would always end up eating if I kept on wiggling the rodent, eventually. The weird poop does seem to be rodent fur, some bones, and a little bit of mucus, the idea that he ate some paper towel makes a lot of sense as well, and it never even crossed my mind! I know for a fact he does not have any parasites, but I do have one quick question, how long does it usually take an adult king (3 year old) to shed? He's only ever shed twice in the year he has been with me, but I never paid attention to how long it took him to finish shedding. I'm almost positive he's getting ready to shed, as his belly is a light pink, as well as his sides and he has gotten very dull. Thank you once again for your help, I'm so greatful to you.
    Last edited by Kytero; 11-04-2018 at 09:28 PM.

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    -How do you know he's 3 years old? Have you had him since a hatchling, or is this what you were told?

    -What are the temps (highest & lowest) in his cage? how is it heated? size & type enclosure? how is the heat regulated?

    -Bear in mind I'm not seeing the snake either...I have no way of knowing if he's over-fed, under-fed or showing other signs of illness...more info needed!

    -How often are you feeding him? AND since you mentioned his history of eating issues, it really might be time for a vet check along with a stool sample.

    -Is it possible that he isn't warm enough to digest food, or that he senses (from the chill in the room) that he needs to brumate???

    -when you feed him, I recommend that (if he doesn't take food from tongs, or if he lays it down after taking it) feed him on a "plate" of some kind.
    it can be a paper plate or a plastic one, even a box lid...but you need to make sure that his substrate (paper towels) do not stick to his damp rodent, thereby getting
    swallowed. Snakes have great digestion, but cannot digest things like wood chips, paper, cloth; it's possible that such things can cause internal blockage if accidentally
    consumed. You can see the "weird poop" much better than I can online...it may well be fur & bones, but I noticed the paper towels & it's easy for a snake to ingest
    a little substrate if you're not careful about how you feed them.

    -snakes take varying amounts of time to shed...if you feed him during a shed (& he takes it) it will slow things down greatly. Recommend against food while in shed.

    -the older a snake gets, the less often he sheds. 3 years old is fairly young...shedding only twice a year seems a little "off" for his age, if correct.

    -the quote below may or may not be a significant feeding issue; this is the way a snake typically behaves when they're somewhere along in their shed cycle & don't
    REALLY WANT to eat. I hope you are keeping a feeding record on him (w/ relevant observations)...should you need a vet's help, it would really be helpful.

    ...."an example would be striking, constricting for an hour, and then letting go and acting like the food isn't even there, but he would always end up eating if I kept on wiggling the rodent, eventually."
    Last edited by Bogertophis; 11-04-2018 at 10:40 PM.

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    Re: Weird Brooks Kingsnake Poop?

    I was told he was 2 years old when I got him a year ago, he had always been very confused on how to eat if he didn't grab the head, he had always been like that but always ended up eating either way. His temps are 88 warm side and 75 coolside, the heat is regulated by under belly heat tape in a rack system with a herpstat. He looks healthy, I have checked his mouth, nose, eyes and rest of his body for any signs or illness (scale rot, RI, etc) but have found nothing. He has sneezed once in my care but that was during a shed. I feed him a small rat once every 10-14 days, but in the last feeding, I thawed out one that was a little too big, I'm wondering if that could possibly be the cause of him spitting it back out? After helping him feed for months, he finally learned how to strike and eat the rodent without letting go and forgetting it was there. I'm thinking it could have been a habit he picked up from the breeder who had him before me. Either way, he doesnt have problems eating anymore besides not wanting to eat during this shed. As for pictures of him, I only have one at the moment but I can get some more later. He was a bit of a chunky monkey before so I changed his every 10 day feeding to 14 days and that seemed to do him well. Vet wise, I can't do anything with them. Before I ever got into the snake buisness I made sure there was a vet who knew about reptiles in my area. However, after actually bringing one reptile to the vet because of a small cut, the vet didn't know anything about the snake or even what kind it was (she was an Eastern kingsnake) they ended up bringing her into "the back" and she died a day after. She was perfectly healthy before I brought her to the vet.

    Here is a picture of my brooks king, he's a good weight now. He was a little more thick in the picture above, though. I apologize for the quality of the image above, I will get better ones soon.
    Last edited by Kytero; 11-04-2018 at 11:19 PM.

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    Re: Weird Brooks Kingsnake Poop?

    Quote Originally Posted by Kytero View Post
    I was told he was 2 years old when I got him a year ago, he had always been very confused on how to eat if he didn't grab the head, he had always been like that but always ended up eating either way. His temps are 88 warm side and 75 coolside, the heat is regulated by under belly heat tape in a rack system with a herpstat. He looks healthy, I have checked his mouth, nose, eyes and rest of his body for any signs or illness (scale rot, RI, etc) but have found nothing. He has sneezed once in my care but that was during a shed. I feed him a small rat once every 10-14 days, but in the last feeding, I thawed out one that was a little too big, I'm wondering if that could possibly be the cause of him spitting it back out? After helping him feed for months, he finally learned how to strike and eat the rodent without letting go and forgetting it was there. I'm thinking it could have been a habit he picked up from the breeder who had him before me. Either way, he doesnt have problems eating anymore besides not wanting to eat during this shed. As for pictures of him, I only have one at the moment but I can get some more later. He was a bit of a chunky monkey before so I changed his every 10 day feeding to 14 days and that seemed to do him well. Vet wise, I can't do anything with them. Before I ever got into the snake buisness I made sure there was a vet who knew about reptiles in my area. However, after actually bringing one reptile to the vet because of a small cut, the vet didn't know anything about the snake or even what kind it was (she was an Eastern kingsnake) they ended up bringing her into "the back" and she died a day after. She was perfectly healthy before I brought her to the vet.

    Here is a picture of my brooks king, he's a good weight now. He was a little more thick in the picture above, though. I apologize for the quality of the image above, I will get better ones soon.
    Looks like it could be a stunner !!

    I'm intrigued


    Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro




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    That looks like a half digested mouse to me.
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    1.0 Red Blood '18

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    Bogertophis's Avatar
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    First off, I am SO sorry about the awful experience you had with your late Eastern king snake & the local vet. Not seeing the "small cut" she had, but while I wouldn't
    call that "perfectly healthy" I also would never have expected her to die the next day without a REALLY good explanation. I've seen both very helpful & marginal vets
    when it comes to snakes, but just because they don't recognize a species doesn't mean they aren't able to practice quality medical care for a snake. Their medical
    expertise is the main thing, & since there are SO many kinds of snakes, identifying every species may not be their strong suit, but once you identify it they should
    be able to use references to check the basics of husbandry for that species, & should be able to apply their medical knowledge accordingly. It's most important they
    know what medications are safe for snakes, since they're very different from other animals (as I'm sure you know). Vets do have a tough job though, when it comes
    to snakes: they give the fewest clues of almost any pets, so the more we can tell the vet, the better they can be of help. I've had the experience of "knowing" some-
    thing was wrong (that my snake wasn't feeling good) yet the vet couldn't tell a thing...believe me, I understand your frustration. Lucky are the keepers who live near
    a really good herp vet, one who likes snakes & is truly interested in their unique care.

    Anyway, I've kept various king snakes in the past...I pretty much fed them adult mice, not rats. I suspect your guy is over-fed*, and yes, maybe that's why he spit
    out that larger rat. Adult kings can be fed every 10-14 days, but not if the meals are too big. Does he not like mice? Or was he raised on rats? Have you offered him
    a mouse? (*& you're right, I can't tell much from that photo, lol)

    If he's really shedding only twice a year, I suspect he was older than 2 when you got him from the breeder. Not every person who wants to make a sale is truthful, and
    if telling you his real age would have killed the sale, you have to be a little suspicious. (how long is he, anyway?)

    Had to laugh a little with your description of him grabbing food, then dropping it & being unable to find the head etc. That sounds like my oldest corn snake, but he's
    over 19 years now. His vision has gotten worse in recent years. Just like some humans have better vision than others, the same thing happens with snakes. Many also
    say that pink-eyed snakes have poorer vision, & judging from the ones I've had (albino cal kings) I agree...possibly because light (glare) tends to overwhelm them. And
    most snakes don't visually identify things well to begin with, they mostly chase motion & "hope it fits" once they catch whatever it is. Which is why we sometimes get
    accidental feeding bites from our eager pets...they aren't logical, just "optimistic". Many snakes are so excited about food that they pay no attention & eat "backwards".
    I have one that no matter which way I offer his prey from feeding tongs, he'll only take the end I didn't offer??? -if he could talk, we'd never agree on anything...LOL

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