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  1. #21
    Bogertophis's Avatar
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    This is an interesting discussion, though none of my snakes are big enough to consume kittens, much less cats, & I'd personally never even feed
    wild rodents to my snakes, because of the risks of diseases, parasites (including fleas that can jump off on me & my dogs!) & possible exposure to
    pesticides or other unhealthy things in the environment that hadn't yet killed the rodent but could affect my snakes.

    But pet overpopulation IS a very real problem- as are loose cats & dogs. And in many parts of the world, they are looked upon very differently.
    Many years ago I spent a year in South Korea...and seeing dogs crammed into crates on the back of bicycles ridden to the meat market was heart-
    breaking. And if a loose dog happened to get hit crossing a street it was immediately scooped up by a passing motorist for dinner, not for first aid.
    It didn't matter if it was someone's pet that had only just got loose, it was fair game.

    Many of us (myself included) love horses, and most owners take good care of them. But more than we'd like to admit, people are keeping horses
    that shouldn't: maybe they've fallen on hard times, but they fail for whatever reasons to feed & care for them and their animals are left suffering,
    without food & water. Yet we frown on consuming them here, while many other countries have no such hesitation.

    Before I got into snakes, I had all sorts of pet rodents (hamsters, rats & chipmunks), yet when I got to know snakes, I was able to "take sides" &
    raise rats, mice & hamsters as both pets (to sell) & feeders. I try to think of myself as taking the role of nature...keeping back the best to breed
    (or to sell as pets, when I had a side business), & feed off the others (as they'd be in the natural food chain).

    I don't know what all the answers are, but I know our society needs to address these issues. I'm neither a vegetarian nor the most carnivorous person
    around (I actually prefer soy burgers to real ones, lol) but I do think that animals all deserve respect & humane care. Just because we don't want to
    use feral cats (or dogs etc.) as feeders, doesn't mean that we should ignore the problem. Inevitably we get drawn into all sorts of discussions about
    pets because many people think we're horrible for even feeding rodents to snakes, even by people who eat meat themselves.

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  3. #22
    BPnet Veteran Alter-Echo's Avatar
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    I honestly don't view any animal as being "off limits", in the end we are all just just meat and bone and hair, the only differences are the ones humans choose to create.

    That being said, parasites and or medications are a serious concern, so I personally wouldn't do it based on this fact alone. My uncle used to feed his Burmese roadkill, he would freeze it for a few weeks then thaw and feed and had no issues with parasites, but I don't think I would want to risk it, since many bacteria can survive that.

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  5. #23
    BPnet Veteran Godzilla78's Avatar
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    Re: Kittens For Food?


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  7. #24
    Bogertophis's Avatar
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    Thanks for the laugh, Godzilla78...unfortunately, your photo-shop may also make PETA's "day" and hysteria among the "cat community" & all those
    snake-haters who don't know a corn snake from an anaconda.

  8. #25
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    Breeding cats similar to breeding rats/mice to become feeders do not serve any purpose in addressing the feral cat population. It is just adding cat to the menu and have the reptile community suffer from cat lovers across the world.

    Feeding feral kittens (f/t) if it passed naturally, more than likely it has died from parasites and disease. Most are underweight so I don't know how they would have the same nutrition value as a well fed, health rat. I fostered feral kittens and many are very sick. I don't know many feral kittens who are born wild and remain illness free and parasite free. Coccidia is a common parasite that kills them if medication is not provided. And keeping a young sick kitten alive requires a cocktail of meds, plus vaccines, just to see improvement in their health.

    TNR (Trap Neuter Release) programs work. If one knows how feral colonies operate, this is by far the most efficient way to cut down colony populations. If you do exactly what everyone else had been trying for decades, which is to kill as many feral cats as possible, you will fail. Why? Because cats are territorial. You kill off a group of established cats just so in a few weeks later, you will find another group, maybe even larger in numbers, moving in to the same space. Feral colonies that are established do not roam everywhere: they stay within a certain set of perimeters of their territory. If you remove them, their neighbors will take over and make more babies. By TNR, no babies are created, the current generations hold down their territory until they die from natural causes or otherwise. They also do the same to neighboring colonies. Their populations do decrease over time.

    If you were to take the feral kittens but not the mom, it solves nothing. Instead, you just made the feral population go up faster. A mom cat who lost her kittens will go into heat rather quickly, thus baby making time. Trapping the mom and spaying her while socializing, caring and adopting out the babies work. If you don't get the mom, you end up with another litter.

    I do agree that the feral cat population is a problem. But they did not show up on our doorstep overnight. Educating the public about fixing their cats, encourage them to keep their cats indoors, and offer low cost or free spay/neuter programs as well as the TNR programs will help address this problem.

    I would like to think that the reptile community are a group of ANIMAL lovers despite of what others think of us.

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  10. #26
    Bogertophis's Avatar
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    Re: Kittens For Food?

    Cheesenugget, I appreciate & agree with your reasons that feral cats (kittens) are unsuitable "feeders" but I absolutely do not agree with "TNR"- and never will.

    Cats are DOMESTIC animals, NOT NATIVE wildlife...as such, they should be removed from the wild by all means necessary to protect our native species.
    It's no different than removing & euthanizing the non-native giant snakes being found loose in Florida...the only difference is that you happen to prefer cats.

    You are certainly among animal lovers here...but it it's not right for your pet of choice to take over as if it belongs everywhere, killing & maiming the species
    that DO belong here. TNR is ridiculous: feral cats continue to damage property, attack not only wildlife but pets, spread diseases and parasites, and ruin
    organic gardens where people like myself work very hard to produce healthy food that is safe for humans to eat, and cause accidents when they run in front
    of cars. The public has long been "educated" about fixing their cats...how's that working for ya? It's NOT.

    How many cat lovers believe their cats should never roam outside, out of their yard? I can probably count them on one hand...sadly, I've concluded that
    people who claim to love their cats are more lazy than love-filled...it's just so much easier to let their cat run loose than to pick up after it or deal with it's
    social & exercise needs. How thoughtful of your neighbors property....it's not only "feral" cats but loose cats- "pets"- that are a problem now everywhere.
    A big thanks for all that animal love, that has blinded cat-owners into thinking their cat deserves access to every else's property, including nature preserves
    and public parks. If you love cats, or any other pets, you keep them home where they are protected & cared for. Don't tell me how much cat owners "care"!

    What was once a farmer's means of controlling rodents in their barn on private land is now a public menace everywhere...but that was LONG ago! The world
    has changed, in case you haven't noticed. Human population continues to expand, along with their roaming cats, all the while space between us gets ever
    smaller & more precious...it gets harder for native birds, reptiles, amphibians & mammals to survive. Do we want a world filled with nature's diversity of life? Or a world with just cats?
    Last edited by Bogertophis; 05-29-2018 at 11:11 AM.

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  12. #27
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    I say all lines are figments. We do so much to try and seperate ourselves from the rest of the animal kingdom. But really, what seperates us, or cats, or dogs, or snakes from any other carbon based life form on this planet? Mostly our egos imo. We all fit nicely into the food chain.
    I say if it will help control overpopulation, do it. This planet is completely overpopulated now.
    Plus i find it hard to get all pissy about F/T kittens when it is perfectly ok to snatch wild critters out of nature and put them in glass boxes for the rest of their lives like tiny scaley felons.
    Just my two cents

  13. #28
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    Re: Kittens For Food?

    Quote Originally Posted by godzilla78 View Post
    yes!!!!! Bahahaha

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  15. #29
    BPnet Senior Member AbsoluteApril's Avatar
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    Re: Kittens For Food?

    Quote Originally Posted by zina10 View Post
    It's time people are held accountable for their pets. Unless they are barn cats (which usually stay on the large rural property and have a job) it should be against the law to let your cats be outside to become a nuisance to others. It should also be punished to abandon animals.

    I know...Not easy and what a outcry it would be from cat owners.
    As a cat lover and cat owner, not all of us think they should be allowed outdoors.
    Mine are fixed and indoor only, as they should be. I also support removal of ferals and mandatory spay/neuter for pets.

    I guess that's all I will add to this conversation as a lot of comments I agree with and others I find it poor taste.
    Lovely thing about the world is people can have different opinions.
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    For the Horde!

  16. #30
    BPnet Veteran Slicercrush's Avatar
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    Personally, as stated above, if they were raised for consumption, like bred from a proper feeder company, and I had a snake that was large enough...MAYBE. It would be odd for me, because I usually see F/T as "its already dead", but my mind throughout the year has also been taught that kittens are pets only, so who knows. Then again, I did used to have pet mice, and I don't feel bad feeding them to my snake, so I feel like I could possibly be able to do it.

    As for a wild caught population, definitely not. Anything wild caught that's used as a "feeder" is really something I don't like to touch, because of parasites, disease, etc etc, it was already touched above in full.

    Feral cats are definitely a problem. There's quite a few where I live, and we're just a large suburb in the middle of a bunch of other suburbs with a little bit of forest sprinkled here and there. My neighbors let their cats out all the time, though I believe that they are spayed/neutered, its obvious that plenty of people aren't doing the same. Even if they are, I don't believe they should be let outside (killing off local animal population, etc), and sadly I've started to find my own fair share of new, young cats trailing around here. I don't enjoy in the slightest how its legal, and dont think it should be. I personally think its dumb to say a cat can roam, but a small dog is 1000x more dangerous and must be kept inside. All animals have their risk, especially if they aren't a local species, which most house cats aren't.
    Last edited by Slicercrush; 05-29-2018 at 02:08 PM.
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